LGT vs Mazda 6 MPS - Wheel Magazine (Aust)

[ozgt]

Wheels Magazine (Australia, Dec 2005) has just published their comparison of the Mazda 6 MPS and MY06 Subaru Liberty GT.

 

While the Subaru is far from disgraced, the Mazda outscores it in almost every category, except fuel consumption and braking. Overall the MPS scores 4.5 stars (out of 5) vs the LGTs 4 stars.

 

The Mazda is quicker, has more confident handling, is better equipped in most areas and better priced. It looks like game on, full credit to Mazda for stepping up to the mark keep Subaru honest!

 

The article does acknowledge that Subaru Australia is soon to release the "tuned by STi" GT, and will be releasing an all new (to Australia) 2.5 litre GT towards the end of 2006, but they weren't willing to wait.

 

Performance figures

LGT

0-100 km/hr 6.4 sec

0-400m 14.6 sec @ 155 km/hr

80-120 km/hr 4.7 sec (3rd gear)

 

MPS

0-100 km/hr 6.5 sec

0-400m 14.3 sec @ 159 km/hr

80-120 km/hr 3.6 secs (3rd gear)

 

The Subaru's actual performance is (typically) wide of the manufacturers claims, while Mazda's is almost spot on. Quote " dont read too much into the 0-100 times, in the real world the MPS is appreciably quicker than the GT" and "It's an ability underlined by the in-gear 80-120 km/hr acceleration times. The MPS absolutely wallops the GT"

 

The LGT gets credit for a clutch and ratios that make it more drivable in the city commute, better fuel consumption, better engine note and a little more attitude "the Subaru is a bloody hoot on dirt". The LGT also scores a 5 star NCAP safety rating vs the Mazdas 4 star.

 

"The Subaru feels like a good car that has been raised to another level, while the MPS is a steroidal 6 that is at times inspiring, stunning, even brilliant. And its available $4000 cheaper than the GT without compromising the go-fast bits. For driving enthusiasts who prefer their performance in a brilliantly subtle package, the 6 MPS is a car not to be ignored"

 

Despite all of this I think I still prefer the Subaru and wont be cancelling my order for the "tuned by STi" Liberty GT. But full credit to Mazda. Bring on round two!

[Brady]

What's wrong with the AUDM Legacies if they're hitting 62 mph in 6.4 seconds?!

 

That article basically goes counter to EVERYTHING I would expect of them, except POSSIBLY the better 3rd gear pull, but even that I'm not surprised if it's the 2.3 liter turbo 4, as we already know that the Turbo is set up for quicker spool and better mid-range grunt, and doesn't have the pull up top.

 

How the hell did the Legacy out-brake the Mazdaspeed 6??? Holy bad braking on Mazda's part!

[melayout]

Autoweek got the LGT todo:

 

0-60MPH in 5.2 secs

0-1320 1/4 mile ( 8 feet more than 400m(1312 feet)) in 13.95 secs

 

Their tester sucks sweaty monkey ballz.

 

Everybody raved about Mazda's braking, and I totally expected the Mazda to kill the LGT braking wise, but either the extra lard doesn't help or again their tester sucks.

[BDII]

Autoweek got the LGT todo:

 

0-60MPH in 5.2 secs

0-1320 1/4 mile ( 8 feet more than 400m(1312 feet)) in 13.95 secs

 

Their tester sucks sweaty monkey ballz.

 

Everybody raved about Mazda's braking, and I totally expected the Mazda to kill the LGT braking wise, but either the extra lard doesn't help or again their tester sucks.

 

+1

 

told you guys the MS6 would suck.

 

wait till 07 when there sellin for 19k

[ozgt]

Yeah, Subaru claim 0-100 km/hr in 5.7 secs for the manual GT. None of the motoring magazines have been able to verify this claim (to the best of my knowledge).

 

Mazda brakes were criticized for fade ("over time the pedal progressively lengthens devaluing confidence") while the LGT s "stopping ability never wavers". Maybe this means that the LGTs brakes start out average, but at least dont get any worse?!

[tytek]

Interesting article. But somewhat irrelevant to the US market, where the Legacy GT has the 2.5 cyl engine and the price advantage. i would not mind having both cars, to be honest...

 

0-62 mph times vs. 0-60 mph are usually between 0.3-0.5 sec slower, depending on the car.

 

i need to go and test drive the mazdaspeed6 once i start feeling better. wonder how it compares to my stg2 wagon

[melayout]

Also take into consideration, they are testing the JDM 2.0L twinscroll GT, which is different from our 2.5L singlescroll GT.

 

From the initial numbers, our 2.5GT > MS6.

 

ozgt, got any details on what were the temperature, pressure and altitude of their test track??

[ozgt]

Autoweek got the LGT todo:

 

0-60MPH in 5.2 secs

0-1320 1/4 mile ( 8 feet more than 400m(1312 feet)) in 13.95 secs

 

Their tester sucks sweaty monkey ballz.

 

Everybody raved about Mazda's braking, and I totally expected the Mazda to kill the LGT braking wise, but either the extra lard doesn't help or again their tester sucks.

 

Remember we are comparing Australian specification/tune vehicles here, both the Mazda and Subaru. So it may not directly translate to US spec vehicles. But it does indicate that Mazda is not far off the pace. IMO good to see some healthy competition in this segment.

[melayout]

I know, but take into consideration you have twinscroll and more rated horsepower and torque than the US spec GT and that's why I'm questioning their numbers.

 

On that, are the numbers a lil slow compared to previous AUS-spec GT reviews??

[ozgt]

Also take into consideration, they are testing the JDM 2.0L twinscroll GT, which is different from our 2.5L singlescroll GT.

 

From the initial numbers, our 2.5GT > MS6.

 

ozgt, got any details on what were the temperature, pressure and altitude of their test track??

 

Times were run at Calder Park, near Melbourne, track was dry, temp 14 deg C. Not sure of the altitude, but it is quite low. According to the text they employed "drive train torturing 6000 rpm side-stepping starts" so they seemed to be serious about posting some good times.

 

The Mazda seems to suffer a little in the 0-100km/hr times becasue of the ratios in their 6 speed box and lower redline. The LGT is still in 2nd gear at 100km/hr with its 7600 rpm redline, the Mazda needs to upshift to 3rd gear.

[ozgt]

I know, but take into consideration you have twinscroll and more rated horsepower and torque than the US spec GT and that's why I'm questioning their numbers.

 

On that, are the numbers a lil slow compared to previous AUS-spec GT reviews??

 

Wheels sister magazine, Motor, achieved 6.24 secs 0-100km/hr and 14.52 sec 400m for the LGT. So not much different. Still not close to Subaru's claimed 5.7 sec

 

The Mazda produces 190 kW/380 Nm vs the LGTs 190 kw/330 Nm. In the words of the reviewer "in the real world the message is clear, Mazda's DISI engine is dizzyingly fast". Who knows, maybe the journo is on Mazda Australia's payroll...!?

[fan42025]

I know this has been discussed under another thread but the long term solution for Subaru is clear. Bring out a 3.0 turbo else get out of the game! This is not just in relation to the MPS but also other comparable cars.

[melayout]

Wheels sister magazine, Motor, achieved 6.24 secs 0-100km/hr and 14.52 sec 400m for the LGT. So not much different. Still not close to Subaru's claimed 5.7 sec

 

The Mazda produces 190 kW/380 Nm vs the LGTs 190 kw/330 Nm. In the words of the reviewer "in the real world the message is clear, Mazda's DISI engine is dizzyingly fast". Who knows, maybe the journo is on Mazda Australia's payroll...!?

 

The US-spec gets to 60 a second and 400m half or more seconds faster than the times you mentioned.

 

I don't know what to tell you, the US-spec > JDM-spec??!!!

[RayDhaIn]

Does Aussie-spec = JDM spec?

I thought somewhere in this forum someone says aussie-spec ECU is kinda detuned from the jdm-spec to cope with lower grade gas?

[dmcgowan]

Guys,

 

I drove both the (Aus Spec) GT and MPS whilst looking for a new car. The MPS has the GT's measure across the board - if you drive both, you'll quickly see why Wheels gave it to the MPS. It out handles and out accelerates the GT noticeably in real world driving - it's a very impressive vehicle and cheaper than the GT to boot.

 

I am still banking on the GT Tuned by STi being the best of the three cars though. The MY07 GT is going to have to improve by a fair margin to take sales off the MPS...

 

p.s Ray all AU spec turbo's are tuned differently for 95/98 RON petrol in Aus vs. 100RON available in Japan.

[31337_LGT]

+1

 

told you guys the MS6 would suck.

 

wait till 07 when there sellin for 19k

 

+1 ka-gillion

 

I admit (sadly) that I came from a Mazda, a Mazdaspeed Protege, to be exact. Mazdas just don't hold their value and being a "limited edition" Mazdaspeed doesn't help it hold onto its value any better. Plus, I wasn't too thrilled at some of the warranty horror stories I was reading about.

 

The MS6 may be better in some sense than the LGT, but with it's HP rating, why doesn't Mazda put it up against the Evo or an STI? (even the STi) Sissy-fied Mazda doesn't want to push their cars [and thus, be responsible for their warranties] in order to really compete.

 

I'm still glad I got out of my MSP and into a much better car, my Subie LGT! Besides, just add an AP and some goodies and you'll hand Mazda theirs.

[RobY]

Are you looking to mod?

 

If you are the LGT is a much much much better platform. The EJ207 is no joke.

 

Those times are extremely high. It will be intresting to see other reviews.

[tytek]

the msp6 is considerably larger than both the evo and the sti. it is actually larger than our legacy (more so in width than in lenght), it has a larger trunk, but is also over 200lb heavier.

 

since we have yet to see one on a dyno, I am curious to see what it really puts down - seems like they still subscribe to the old Japanese agreement between manufacturers that limited engine output to around 286hp - as a result, the factory specs were all quoting less power than the car really produced. could this be the case? what is the power to weight ratio of L-GT 5spd and MSP6 6 spd?

[RobY]

why doesn't Mazda put it up against the Evo or an STI? (even the STi)

 

 

Other than the fact that the EVO or STi will run circles around it?

[agctr]

The times are EXTREMELY high and I think they are like that for a reason, not to advocate street racing and stuff like that aka the Australia policy for showing anytype of racing commercials etc of new cars travelling at high speed etc. The reviews in those mags that are done in the UK/Europe seem to be a lot lower in times, when done here, they seem to be a lot higher.

 

NO way would i ever buy a Mazda over an STi / Subaru.

Ada///M.

[31337_LGT]

Other than the fact that the EVO or STi will run circles around it?

That's why I asked why Mazda wouldn't put their 274 ponies up against the likes of Evo or STI...cuz Mazda only wants to pick on LGT's with less power and Mazda is too scared to go up against some true competitors (not saying anything bad about my LGT...I know the potential of the LGT).

 

The Reader's Digest version of this: Mazda sux hehe

[fan42025]

Guys,

 

I am still banking on the GT Tuned by STi being the best of the three cars though. The MY07 GT is going to have to improve by a fair margin to take sales off the MPS....

 

But at what price? You and others have said the Mazda is better performer and yet less cost than the GT. Wouldn't that make the STi even less value for money for a small gain in performance and handling?

 

As for the MY07 well we all know what needs to be done - 3.0T.

[chuckzul]

I personally don't give a rats ass if the Mazda is a little better in accelleration or braking, nor do I see in any of the discussion one the most important aspects of the Subaru at least to me)... that is, it's reliability. What good is a better accelerating or braking car if it spends a lot of time in the shop or you only get 5 or 6 good years out of it before it's ready to go to the junk yard?

[The B4]

That's why I asked why Mazda wouldn't put their 274 ponies up against the likes of Evo or STI...cuz Mazda only wants to pick on LGT's with less power and Mazda is too scared to go up against some true competitors (not saying anything bad about my LGT...I know the potential of the LGT).

 

The Reader's Digest version of this: Mazda sux hehe

 

Evos and sti's are not MS6 competitors... the LGT is ...subaru better bring it in the future...I hope they do to Mazda what they did to Mitsu and the EVo when they upped the HP on STI for production.

[fan42025]

What good is a better accelerating or braking car if it spends a lot of time in the shop or you only get 5 or 6 good years out of it before it's ready to go to the junk yard?

 

True - one needs to include all factors when buying a car, not least of all reliability and even options. That's why I still feel the GT is a reasonable but not great value for money car but the lower end models compared to say Honda Accord are not reasonable at all. Put it in another way, I would never buy a lowe end Subaru but rather have an Accord if that's all I can afford. But since I could easily afford a GT then at the time there wasn't anything else in the same price range to compete.