AMileHighLGT

JMP is awesome hands down the best person to get a rebuild from..

I am using the stock housing but I picked up some JDM HIDs for the fogs that were plug and play. I can go out and take a look later this week for you to tell you which ones I am running.

Don't worry about it. I was just curious if they were actually retro fitted.

Congrats on the new addition! Enjoy these baby days while you can, by the time they are 3 its a whole different animal and they talk back to you! I find myself going through pictures from then and it makes me bitter sweet.

+1 for JMP, his craftsmanship, support, advice, and quick turn around are par none. Some of these other idiots that rebuild turbos like hill country take weeks. I've got one of his rebuilds with just under 60k miles on it and love it. ~4 years old now.

If you don't mind my asking, what did you do with the fogs? Did you ditch the stock housings or did you retrofit HID's to them? from what I've seen retrofitting them is next to impossible because of space.

you have applied a stage 2 tune to a vehicle that doesn't have all the necessary stage 2 parts yet, that is why you are under boosting. The stage 2 map from Cobb is meant to be run on their boost control solenoid. Cobb's boost solenoid is not the same as the Subaru solenoid.

It is 100% to do with the tune, and your inability to read the map notes to see what parts are needed for that tune. May I suggest you brush up on the map notes on Cobb's website?

I'm surprised to see no one has asked this yet.

Are you still on the stock boost controller?

To be more precise, it only misfires under vacuum. It still occurs at high RPM when MPH=0, and I have a few logs where it sporadically showed up when MPH>0 (not a continuously rising count though).

The head keeps staring at me saying "just pry me open a little bit... come on, you know you want to see what's inside." It's so hard not just going in for a little peek. Buying new gaskets (and studs?) would be enough to keep me from getting out of debt this month so it'll just have to wait.

You wont have a vacuum condition at higher rpm even with a 0 veh. speed.

Compression test wont tell you how well the cylinder is sealing. I think ive stated this before. a leakdown test will show a burned valve. it just may not be severe enough to stick out at you. if you dont see any scoring with the boroscope then your cylinder walls should be ok. i had 108k when i pulled my motor due to #4 ringland failure, walls were not scored up.

in the pictures you have of the cylinder wall and piston the junk at the top of the cylinder wall is called ring ridge its just the area on the cylinder wall that does not get scraped by the piston. I would venture to say your ringlands in that cylinder are PROBABLY ok. When i pulled the head off my motor for the fuct ringland, the ring ridge was excessive, and comprised of nothing but burned oil sitting at the top, in a cake like consistency.

sorry i havent been around here lately man, started a new job.

"And if there's enough left over, I'm gonna fly you all down here to help us dedicate it."

"I cant swim, Clark"

The last 5 minutes prior to turning it off was stop/go traffic with a couple red lights and stop signs.

 

When I got home I turned it off a few seconds after completely stopping the car, the idle was smooth (but with a barely noticeable misfire).

When I started it back up after dinner it was immediately idling rough. When I'm accelerating while the idle is acting up it does seem to stutter slightly at about 3k rpm.

 

 

 

For future readers: His first tip, and possibly his second tip also, is why people sometimes say "you can't believe everything on the internet".

 

 

 

My issues don't seem to be correlated with engine temp at all.

 

I've experienced smooth and rough idles in cold weather with both cold and warm starts, and I've experienced smooth and rough idles in warm weather with both cold and warm starts. As best as I can tell the engine temp has little to zero affect on the symptoms.

 

When it's in a bad mood and idling rough it is always also idling low, like between 400-700 rpm. It's almost like the ECU isn't reading the idle properly. Don't get too excited just yet, because even when its idling properly the misfire is still present.

You have a vacuum gauge?

If it is a burned valve, it would come and go with temperature as the block warms and cools. I have seen that before.

I had a cracked ringland. It would pass compression testing it finally failed one and then a leakdown test confirmed it. I compression tested once I knew something was up. I had a cyl 4 misfire. It wouldn't log any misfires when cruising and accelerating. Only at idle. And even then there were some times it wouldn't at all. I understand why you're asking. And yes it is logical, but if you think what happens inside the cylinder walls, that's all pretty violent stuff going on. And when it comes to cars and car repairs always expect the unexpected.

This is the most epic response I've ever seen.

His one and only post

After I got past your attitude and scary formatting it looks like you actually have some good points.

If i come of as an abrasive ass, insert adjective here, thats just who i am. I tell you how i see it. I know i have some good points, i do this for a living.

1. I haven't done another compression test yet. I didn't unplug the injectors, but I did pull the fuel pump fuse and run the engine dry before doing the test.

That works too, as long as you disabled the system in any way is all that matter.

2. To be totally honest, I've been chasing injector #2 because it's easy to get to. I work two jobs (60+ hrs) so that my wife can stay home with our kids, so whenever I'm home my family usually takes priority. Most weekends my car sits in the garage and doesn't even get a second glance. I'm trying to exhaust all of my easy and cheap options before moving on to the time-consuming ones.

I understand work and family commitments man, i hear you. Just so you know often times exhausting the easy options first is costly, and time consuming. Im not saying youre wasting money with the mr injector stuff, im not judging you. I just think it would be cheaper and less time consuming in the long run for you if you dont do the easy and basics, you need to be chasing the essentials to good complete combustion in all your cylinders.

3. You're right, I probably should do a leak-down test. See #2 for why I haven't done one yet. I've been documenting my progress (or rabbit chasing) on here because I like/need input, and also because my trial-and-error education may be helpful to someone else someday.

I didnt go back to look yet There is no issue from me with you documenting on here, im doing it myself.

If you think I'm an idiot or you just aren't interested in watching me solve the problem then unsubscribe from the thread. Let's not start an Internet fight.

On the contrary!! I am happy to see you undertake this on your own, in a day and age where 'Men' aren't really men anymore in the real sense of the word, guys who would rather pay someone to figure out a problem on a car and then get dirty fixing it. Mad props dude! I am more than 'interested' to see YOU succeed at nailing this down and never experience that annoying ass misfire ever again!! I am here to provide any knowledge and assistance that I can to you, and any other member in this community. My abrasiveness has nothing to do with wanting to start an internet fight with you, do I look like Mr.Tris?

4. If my bank 1 (front) O2 sensor is reading >2.6 volts that means my A/F ratio is lean. Right? It's just a data point worth mentioning. I should have been more clear and said "...at least one of my cylinders is running lean, I'm assuming it's #2."

Well, kind of... Bank 1 just means the upstream sensor in the exhaust.

Here is what is throwing you off. You are looking at your front o2 sensor data point in your android app. Your android app is mislabeling the paramater as an oxygen sensor, even though it is not an 'oxygen sensor', it is a narrow band air fuel ratio sensor. If it were an oxygen sensor, the voltage they produce is anywhere from .1v-.9v. .1v being lean and .9v being rich. Fundamentally, air-fuel sensors work just like regular oxygen sensors, but in a mirror fashion. When the condition is rich they decrease in voltage. To the contrary, when the condition is lean their voltage spikes. This is opposite of our normal inclination to view high voltages as a rich indicator, and low ones as a lean indicator, so be careful. Subaru does not specify a perfect mixture condition in a voltage that you can compare to what you see in your app, but, in my experiences with subaru, MOST of the time about 2.4v is a perfect mix, important to note though, i have not even looked at this on a legacy so i cant guarantee that info.

so this is what you do to see if its at least working in a somewhat easy fashion because im pretty sure you do not have access to a digital storage oscilloscope and a low amp probe.

With engine running, disconnect the hose that runs from the driver side of the black intake manifold that runs up to the fuel pressure regulator. Watch the bank 1 sensor 1 parameter, look for a change, note how high it goes. Then force a rich condition by spraying a little bit of carb clean into the port that you just disconnected and note how low it goes.

or

If you have an ohm meter you could hook it up in series on the signal line, and check the milliamp draw on the sensor. perfect would be no milliamps. view every .100 milliamp above 0 as 1% lean, and every .100 milliamp under 0 as 1% rich. if you get to .800 milliamp + or - there is a problem. you would perform this test with the engine running.

Better yet, if you can see a/f learning a, b, c and d that would be even better.

So... should I do a leak-down test or not? :spin:

It'll probably get to that point, but wouldn't it be much simpler if I could narrow it down to something simple like a loose or exposed wire?

Yes, it would be simpler, but maybe longer, and costlier, but considering the low compression results you have already posted i would just get a leakdown done.

Im thirsty and its beer time. cheers!

1/3/15: Tested the compression of each cylinder and got 59/60/61/60. I think my numbers were so low because I tested it cold (~65°F). If needed I'll test everything again later this week with the engine warmed up.

***** March 8

If the P0302 code was a quarter I'd be a wealthy man.

 

The P0301 code I got on Jan 15 must have been a fluke. Other than that one time it's been a P0302 code every time. I guess I just got too excited thinking I had the problem narrowed down to my injector that I didn't realize the code I kept having to clear was for cylinder #2.

 

• Moved the injector from cyl#2 back into cyl#1 (where it first started).
  
• Replaced the injector in cyl#2 with the new (rebuilt) one i got on ebay.
  

Also you should consider ditching a compression test, and go straight to the leak down test. It will tell you whether your losing compression past intake or exhaust valves or piston rings. It will also tell you the percentage of leakage. I dont want to see anymore updates, that are not really an update because you are chasing the same shit. over and over and over again. If you cant leak down test the motor, then pay someone to do it.

***** March 8 - April 2

Every time I drive my car the misfire is noticable. The P0302 code isn't always present, and my CEL rarely comes on.

Here's what's really strange... on several occasions my drive to a destination (grocery store) as been rough, and my drive BACK was virtually flawless. One particular evening my wife and I stopped by her friend's apartment to pick up some kids clothes. Our drive heading into the apartment complex was miserable, like the car was trying to stall on me whenever the clutch was disengaged (pedal in) for long enough to let the engine slow to idle. While my wife ran inside to chat about whatever girls like to chat about, I stayed out in the car. While I sat the car idled rough, but it didn't stall. Our slow drive out of her friend's apartment complex was perfect... I'm talking about a buttery smooth idle at stop signs. The engine was fully warmed up for both 'legs' of our errand, so what could cause the engine to apparently fix itself after just a few minutes of idling? Letting the car idle in my driveway has never had a positive effect like it did here.

***** April 8

Last weekend I sprayed carb cleaner all over my engine bay and the idle didn't noticeably change.

I'm going to attempt a DIY smoke test this upcoming weekend.

Voltage readings from my O2 sensor indicate cyl#2 is running lean, so I think my my next rabbit hole will be looking for a wiring issue.

You see your numbers indicating a lean, well yeah. The oxygen drawn into the cylinder is not burned. Therefore oxygen leaves the cylinder unburned. It acts like a 'slug of oxygen' running through the exhaust, of course youre going to see lean on the post cat sensor...

Just curious. Why would you want to bypass the filter?

He installed a replaceable fuel filter in the engine bay.

I think brand new Subaru's are finally as reliable as all Japanese cars were in 2000. Which is good, because today all other Japanese cars are becoming very cheaply built and unreliable too.

I disagree. The Fa20 engines are horrible with consuming oil. Many owners have already had multiple rebuilds under warranty with no change to the condition. I know of several 15wrx and stis that literally bring on a rod knock soon as they hit around 3k miles.

OBXT was my answer for with kids car and dog. Couldn't do minivan or another SUV.

I was happy to see the Navigator leave the fleet after two head fixes and 91 octane requirement.

Those heads are a f****** pain in the ass!!!

I haven't looked at it any closer than I needed to in order to remove the injector. The misfire started out in cyl#2 and moved when I swapped the injector with the one from cyl#1. If there was something wrong with a harness or wiring then I think swapping injectors wouldn't have caused the misfire to move.

That is true. Sorry I didn't go through and reread if you had swapped it

Do not throw washers in the turbo inlet. That's not a very good idea.

 

Hate to say it, but, if moving the injector doesn't move your misfire, well. .

 

You need a new shortblock. ™

LMAO

Did you ever recheck your compression on the engine when warm?

 

Dealer told me when I bought the car last year (had rough idle then) that it was just "normal" behavior for the LGT to have a rough idle.....

did you go to groove too? lol