SeeeeeYa

Just a reminder that the complete construction plans of the BulletProof-TMIC Mod are still available. They enable a DIY approach or as the guide for your machine shop of choice. A PM to me is all it takes to get them as long as I'm still around.

I'd be remiss if I did not once again thank all those who have chosen the BPTMIC-Mod over these many years, and a special thanks to all those who contributed to its development and refinement. They took my original crude ideas and made them the finished product. We, the LGT community, built it, but it was the moderators and administrators of LegacyGT.com that provided a home for it. I and the many who have benefitted from it will be forever grateful for their support. 

A picture of my '05 LGT at full chat on the Dragon is still above my desk. And while I went on to own and modify a number of later Subies, including an STi and three WRXs I'll never own a car that I loved more than my LGT. It is, to me, Subaru''s most beautiful car, with an engine that should have died many times during the years of tuning, modding, and meth... but never failed nor faltered (although it broke about every other thing in the drivetrain LOL). At the end of my ownership it was a local legend that all admired but no one dared to challenge. I miss it and always will.

Be safe and enjoy life with all you've got. It is a short trip.

FWIW, I still send the complete plans to anyone who wants them as I have since the beginning. Send me a PM and I'll provide instructions on how to get the plans.

This has been mentioned a number of times in the thread but it gets buried I suppose as time goes one... it has been a while.

I read part of this thread and couldn't help but read more. It's like watching Tiger King with Exotic Joe explaining that facts, reason, and science are for pencil pushers. I got a great kick out of it. Thank you to everyone for the interesting read and thread-theatre.

 

Things I have learned on this thread:

 

1. A Semi-truck would benefit from replacing it's heavy "heat sink" radiator with a Honda Civic radiator because it can heat up/down faster (ignoring surface area of the larger radiator) and the larger radiator only acts as a heat sink. Having the smallest possible volume of water in a radiator is superior because the temperature can change more quickly, which is a good thing. A radiator the size of Lake Michigan would only act as a heat sink with consistent temperatures, which is bad. Temperatures that swing the most wildly are preferable.

 

2. Each individual cm^2 of an IC does not transfer thermal energy equally if one intercooler is 10 inches long compared to one that is 20 inches long because the metal is self aware. The metal used in larger intercoolers is quite lazy, per unit of area, and does not work as hard as the same unit area of metal in smaller intercoolers.

 

3. 10cm^2 of a smaller intercooler will cool air better than 10cm^2 of a larger intercooler. In fact, if a person were able to take an aftermarket IC and then cut it down to the size of the stock size, it would work better, but not as good as the stock IC.

 

4. Plastic end caps are great insulators, which means they protect against heat transfer.

 

5. Surface area is the enemy of heat transfer

 

6. If intake air has more channels to flow through with greater internal fin structure as well as greater external surface transfer to the same airflow, that is bad. Somehow.

 

7. Stock is always best. Manufacturers tune their vehicles to the best possible performance and reliability for that specific vehicle, without other production concerns, internal politics, and external factors.

 

8. A person that is 6'4" driving a Subaru would add way too much off-center mass above the center of gravity compared to a person that is 5'8". In fact, the car would be nearly undriveable and may flip or slide off the road, ignoring off center changes in stereo weights, speakers, windshield changes in weight, and other factors that changed pounds of weight in ceiling mass. There is no way that a taller person could beat a shorter person around a track. In fact, if a car has an empty roof rack, the same car without a roof rack would beat it every time.

 

9. R&D departments are pointless, especially aftermarket competitors and race and rally teams.

 

10. Science, evidence, facts, and controlled testing are for people that don't "believe".

 

Anyway, thanks everyone. I have to imagine that a lot of people were just egging each other on with their arguments. In any case, this put a smile on my face in our weird times.

Notice the silence?

That's because the perspective of the person posting the above assumes his satire is funny... kind of like a foul mouthed commedian at a church service is. Wrong crowd son.

Many people like their LGTs just the way they came, or close to it. No big turbos, no big mods to threaten one of Subaru's most iconic models ever.

What those people want, whatever their minor upgrades, is an LGT that continues to function for as long as possible... without known failure issues haunting them. Some of those potential failure points are well known, as are their solutions. One, the subject of this thread, is the intercooler, and in these pages solutions are discussed... with the BPTMIC Mod the one unfailing solution for those who prefer to keep their LGT's motor inside the OEM envelope. For those who do upgrade their engine's power but don't intend to track their cars the OEM TMIC is still the better street use option... with the BPTMIC Mod providing failure proof longevity for whatever power those upgrades may present it.

But if you read the entire thread and not the parts you choose to mock, you'll find contradictions that compromise your act... that people with power upgrades tracked their LGTs, many times, all without failure to their BPTMIC Modded OEM TMIC. You'll also find one other very important fact: Zero failures in all the years since its introduction of properly BPTMIC Modded TMICs. Comforting, yes. Funny, not at all.

I suggest you search out similar BPTMIC threads over on the NASIOC forum where your efforts may earn you a standing ovation. But not here. We're a little more refined in our tastes and find people who make fun of others distasteful enough to walk away and ignore.

Notice the silence. That's feedback of the genteel kind.

Has anyone done this mod and had the resonator removed as well? I have the 3" down pipe with an adapter going to my stock exhaust. Been pretty set on removing the resonator, and now wondering how it would sound with the resonator being out and doing the hogzaust mod?!

The job, and about the only job, that the mid-pipe resonator does... is remove drone. Without it there will be increased "noise," but it's the ugly kind... merely the pipe's resonances adding to, and adulterating IMO, the motor's sounds. The drone from the lack of a midpipe is why I grew to dislike the SPT exhaust on my '11 WRX... it got to be unbearable on interstate drives.

With your down pipe (and I'm assuming tune) it is your stock mufflers that's both restricting power as well as the sound you're looking for. An axelback will solve everything, giving more power and a far better sound.

Disable seatbelt chime has been super helpful.

 

Thank you!

Depending on which car you have, that may be a risky choice.

Some cars have an EDR which records all important vehicle data that can be analyzed in the event of an accident. If there is any bodily injury to any occupants, AND they find the seatbelts weren't on OR the warning chime was off... it'll be your fault and the insurance will likely use that to deny any claims. Heaven help you if there is a death.

Then there are civil lawsuits to consider.

Just a thought...

As always, for those who have the skills and inclination, my original plans are available on request via email to jeffhufman@yahoo.com.

That said, were I to need a BP Mod again, I’d buy a kit. It’s not hard to make, but it is exacting and time consuming.

It’s rewarding to see the time-proven results of my once disparaged original name and claims. The Bullet Proof TMIC Mod is just what it says... thanks in large part to this great website, legacygt.com.

This is really great to hear, although it would’ve been nice to have the information promulgated more directly and formally.

Still, I'm glad the community has a resource and that the BPTMIC Mod is alive and well...

Long live the great LGT!

I can't wait till these are done! I am really happy you are still producing these. This will be a huge help with what my current goals of the car are.

Me, too! BarManBean to the rescue.

It makes the TMIC like it should have come from Subaru... bullet proof.

Could someone link me to the proper sized Corbin clamp?

The most used Subaru clamp for vacuum/boost hoses is part #092311502

Here is an example of kits of clamps available commercially, but they are also available from most autoparts stores.

http://www.jegs.com/p/Dorman-Products/Dorman-Corbin-Style-Clamp-Assortment/2392111/10002/-1

Remember that the correct size is one where you need to open the clamp, by squeezing its end wings, to get it onto the hose. You don't want one whose size allows it to easily slide onto the hose without opening it up. This ensures it will have proper tension to maintain clamping force initially as well as over time.

Clamps can be carefully squeezed to make them slightly tighter... in a case where none of the clamps on hand, from a kit for example, meets the above criteria, such as on an odd-sized small hose. The proper installation procedure is to squeeze the clamp's ends and hold it open, slide it onto the hose far enough back so that the hose can be fully seated onto the nipple, then the clamp is slid forward to within 1/8-1/4" short of the end of the hose, then released.

Corbin clamps are a cheap and permanent solution. Zip ties are cheap for sure, but are not a permanent solution. Zip ties only provide an initial clamping force and do not adjust for aging of the hose. They also degrade with time and environmental influences. Thus, they are a temporary measure and better than no proper clamp at all, but should be replaced with a Corbin Clamp ASAP.

It is boggling to me to continue seeing posts about issues related to unclamped hoses... as this forum has been admonishing owners about the inherent problem since 2004 with countless replies like this one. It is even more boggling when the lesson is not learned... and the problem hose, and ONLY that hose, is fixed. There are nearly a dozen barbless nipples with hoses on them in these early LGTs... which some call "vacuum" hoses, but are in fact also BOOST hoses. A hose that blows off only causes running issues in most cases. One, however, the FPR sense hose, can destroy the engine if it comes off. It's not hard to figure out that a "stitch in time" here with Corbin Clamps not only provides peace of mind... it can keep the wallet from being emptied.

Available at the moment with slightly shorter-than-spec front rails. Function just the same.

Your kits will, most definitely, do their intended job perfectly... protecting the mechanical integrity of the TMIC. After all, I added the front rail on the original as overkill. The top and bottom side rails are what keeps the end tanks on.

When I decided to share my long-sought solution for my failing intercoolers, knowing the inevitable onslaught of forum criticism, I chose a name that reflected my confidence in it. That original one didn't have a front rail. During the time I made and sold it, however, I added it as a stamp of finality, covering the visual memory of where the tanks usually came apart. Obviously, however, to the experienced eye it's clear the front will follow the sides... and stay perfectly tight, front rail or not. It is still overkill, which is the way I like to do things.

Many years later now, with zero reported failures of properly BulletProofed TMICs, any criticism of the BP Mod's efficacy has long since stilled. It is bulletproof.

Thanks to BarManBean it is still available and still BulletProof... even with "slightly shorter-than-spec front rails."

Sorry guys. I already got the info

Keeping track...

Thank you everyone.

Thinking of modding your factory mufflers? They're pre-shaped. No options to put a tip on it you like. But it's quite easy. Just bolt off the factory tips and cut off the 'trumpet'. Patch mufflers up while your at it.

 

http://myalbum.com/photo/UvJIpipjZL6o/360.jpg

 

http://myalbum.com/photo/kz2KfZajNpSz/360.jpg

 

http://myalbum.com/photo/NAVW7IWFD59S/360.jpg

 

http://myalbum.com/photo/JNib2POeveSV_oFQnxv/360.jpg

 

http://myalbum.com/photo/jET2ISfbyFvK/360.jpg

 

http://myalbum.com/photo/1QGLbtQHRgKc/360.jpg

 

( ^ metric)

 

http://myalbum.com/photo/TEXcybXxYR6M/360.jpg

 

http://myalbum.com/photo/pJqOGV5HAE6u/360.jpg

 

http://myalbum.com/photo/HF54jHaxYwIE/360.jpg

 

More info? Ask!

Good innovative modding. I intend to paint my WRX's muffler ends black, too, but am still uncertain of a process that won't flake off like it did on my LGT's... what did you use?

Different from my own long buried posts on here with internal mods I made to my LGT's mufflers, which were more performance oriented than cosmetic. Your mods compliment those of mine nicely as options.

Here is something I've done on my WRX for performance reasons, and also highlights what is lurking within the LGT's mufflers as well.

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2757586

I have an 07 5EAT LGT. I do get a pause/hesitation around 1800 - 2500+ rpms when going from a stop. Then the car finally gets going after 2500+ (boost). Not sure if this is legit stutter or just it being a subaru + turbo + 5EAT. Happens more when it's warmed up (heat

soak?)

 

No other hesitation through the rpm range or other gears.

Do you use Techron? If not, put in a full container next time you fill the tank... Techron first. Then after a day or two see if that hesitation is still there. Likely won't be.

Use no substitute "injector cleaner," Techron only.

Happy New Year!

I still miss my beautiful LGT, so it's always good to see them being given TLC, and that the BP Mod is still part of keeping them safe.

Thank you, legacygt.com, for all the great memories. You're still the best.

^^It's my own fault. In the video, why do you hit the lock with a screwdriver and hammer? From what I could tell, they lock by themselves?

They do, but there's a bit of give. To get things as tight as I like I deform the locking mechanism like that to remove any "play" from the locking mech.

The SS ties use a form of ball bearing clutch... which by design must move before locking. It doesn't move much, but once the tie is tight and at the tension that the user wants, ANY movement backward loosens it. In other words, this kind of tie "backs up" to lock.

Ball bearing clutches work by having friction roll a little steel ball up an incline between the two band surfaces until it forms an interference fit, which then limits further movement. Further, any movement of either band in the opposite direction will loosen the ball's interference fit and the tie will loosen.

Therefore, to ensure the desired tension of the zip tie, two separate actions must occur:

One - at the point of maximum tightness, and while that tightness is being forcibly maintained, simultaneously tapping the locking mechanism causes the mechanism to deform to the ball/band minimum and the ball to create dents in the inclined locking surfaces, preventing it from easily rolling backward and losing band tension/tightness.

Two - to ensure that the lock remain in this maximum tension lockup, the band must be folded back right at the lock onto itself, tapped to ensure the fold is at the maximum rearward angle and flat... then snipped off, leaving enough to cover the lock.

Three - I personally prefer to leave the backward-folded end just long enough to fold under itself a very short amount, again ensuring the fold is as flat as possible. This is to hide the extremely sharp end of the trimmed tie, which will cut if touched.

2 yrs with this mod at stg 2 and 18.5 lbs of boost...still going strong.

Great to hear! Yours was the first official BMB kit to go out, after all

Indeed great to hear!!

To my knowledge, the BP Mod has remained 100% reliable since the first shipped more than four years ago. While the mod itself was designed to provide such reliability, it also speaks for the diligence of those who install them. Keep it up!

I hope everyone knows how lucky they are you have made these fittings available.

Where were you all those years I could have used them!!

I havent looked at any logs recently but when we did there is nothing that jumps out tune related. There is no boost error, no overboosts, no cels, no "freeze" in data, no knock, no feedback, no nothing during the event itself etc. The only thing I saw when pouring over logs *albeit a couple months back* was that during the issue the rpms would actually roll back a tad or stay in the 4500rpm range while everything else progressed through the pull....very strange indeed. I was honestly leaning tword an ignition cutout,collapsing intake or a trans issue. What's weird is him changing out the inlet tube helped temporarily which makes no sense.

 

Chimera - if the ecu was influencing the cutout in terms of a boost limit etc you would get a check engine light.that and the fact that the turbo is already starting to taper at 4500-5k so the boost is under control.

 

 

Dave

Compelling. It argues it may NOT be tune related.

While it has been a long time now, my '05 5EAT LGT also had a "weirdness" under similar conditions that I determined, after a long time, to be transmission related. It somehow had to do with how the tranny handled the torque converter lockup. All I know is, I learned to accept it and to stay in Drive if I didn't want the issue. Seems nothing I did eliminated it, but the more power I made the further along the torque curve it went, which became one of my metrics.

I'm still having issues with this. In 3rd or 4th gear, around 5000rpm's, stumbles (or feels more like a complete cut out) for a split second. Interestingly if I floor it in 'D'rive then it doesn't seem to do it (because when it shifts into 3rd, revs are at about 5,200). However if I put it in tiptronic and change gears manually from 2nd to 3rd (before hitting max rev's in 2nd, so when changing into 3rd, revs are about 4,800) it will stumble for a split second at around 5,000rpm's. It wouldn't be a boost cut limit on the ECU that would be causing it would it?

 

I took it to the mechanic, he basically said because it could be a number of things he didn't want to know. I asked if he could check all the basics but basically got the cold shoulder... all I want is someone to do is a boost leak test, smoke test, check MAF, check O2 sensors etc. I don't have time to muck around with this,... time to change mechanics I think...

Doesn't sound like a job for a mechanic. Sounds like it needs what you don't seem willing (able?) to provide... time, time to log properly.

It sounds like you have a tune issue, an issue that can only be diagnosed and corrected through logging and log review.

I just went and read most of the pages (over 2 days), and my head's still spinning a little. It definitely seems like it requires the replacement of 2-5 different bushing sets/mounts (which you self-fabricated), and even then, it only gets progressively better with each thing replaced.

 

This makes it hard to "plan" what to replace, other than "everything", and as you say "everything" is too expensive for most people.

 

I live in NorCal, and yes, with a somewhat colder winter, I notice it more. And, as has been mentioned over and over, it's easier to reproduce when turning (especially a right-hand turn for me - I've almost never had it in an left-hand turn), and with passengers in the car. But, even now that it's a little worse than 2 or 3 years ago (although basically same drivetrain/suspension setup), it's happening a little more. Suspension mods: Koni springs, Cobb sways front and back, WL LCA bushings, steering rack bushings and upgraded endlinks (endlinks made no difference).

 

The big question I have: how dangerous is it? Are we wearing out part of the drivetrain each time this happens, or is it just something that sounds horrible, but isn't really going to matter as far as overall wear (other than maybe tires)?

 

Lately, I've had a burning oil/grease smell that I haven't had time to fully track down (right after the major coolant leak in this car AND our other one, all within a month of each other). Thought it might be the passenger-side front CV boot again (had it done 3-4 years ago), but after reading this thread I'm wondering if maybe the U-joint grease is leaking/burning??

 

Ahhh.. Ignorance really is bliss

Yes, it can be dangerous... although others have, not too many Subies have wrecked from it but it is dangerous to your car's parts.

Your reading must have revealed that my car suffered a number of failures in the suspension and drivetrain. I'm fairly sure the infamous "noise" broke the diff and axel. The tranny is a different story. As you note, your car makes the noise now more than it once did, that's because the underlying little buggers responsible have become softer with age and use.

And, yes, to fix the noise you have to address more than one or two things. That's because more than one or two things are involved. To get a better idea of what the "noise" is and how to work toward its elimination look at what has worked for those who've been successful in this thread.

Researching the root cause, wheel hop, will further explain. Here is a start: http://www.mc2racing.com/tech/20061012a/

Solved it 5 years ago myself but I don't remember updating this thread...

 

And, yep, with all the work and money I put into the car(s), I can't see myself parting with them. Besides, there aren't any worthy replacements anyway. I could add to the stable, though. Thinking about C7...

 

Edit: I did update it few years back... Oh, well.

I thought you had. But people think it's something addressable with a kit, not the comprehensive elimination of drivetrain compliance. The thread likely won't end here, your fix is too expensive and mine is too back-yard. Anyone serious can find it all in the thread's pages.

I agree, the '05 LGTs have an elementally artful, timeless elegance that doesn't come around very often. With the mechanical upgrades you've done it's irreplaceable. You have an enviable car(?).

FWIW, I no longer have any trace of the noise, no matter how cold, and I put down a lot of more power than when I had the problem (I had the noise with VF40 @ stage1, now I am stage 3 with 300+ whp). I tightened my entire setup when I went with 6MT swap:

 

1. Group-N engine mounts

2. Group-N tranny mount

3. Group-N rear diff bushings (all four, including diff crossmember and subframe)

4. SpecB trailing arms and upper lateral links

5. AVO rear endlinks

 

One or more of these solved the problem, who knows which contributed the most. I remember we were speculating it was the trailing arms with the SpecB bushings.

 

I know rear lower lateral links do not matter (or not much), since I have had the JDM STI ones with spherical bushings for a very long time, and still had the noise issue.

Great to hear you solved it! As I'm sure you remember, I solved mine and outlined the fix five/six years ago. Got a lot of flack saying I was mistaken... LOL. The thread has since gone on for years with people still asking for a solution. We will see if it ends now.

I still miss my LGT. Her picture hangs above my desk, mid-turn on the Dragon. It is good to see you're still caring for yours in the best of ways, as always.

Filled my driveshaft hanger bushing with Windo-Weld Polyurethane. Significant improvement in surging issues and overall driveline slack.

 

Been meaning to do this for 5 years.

That is impressive, and one of the better pieces of ingenuity you've provided.

Wish I'd have thought of it. I used that poly to fill my '05's diff bushings, with a considerable improvement before there were "kits." I also used it to fill the rear LCA bushing, with similar improvements. I've used it elsewhere with success. But I never thought of that one.

I just installed my Cobb AP v2 yesterday, did a couple of logs today, which are attached. That's kind of a lot of knock at high load right? Stage 1, 91 octane map, car is stock.

 

I'm gonna install the Cobb Stock Mode map and do some more logs...and probably think about who I should get an e-tune from.

You're right, that's terrible. Something is wrong, somehow, somewhere.

You're also correct in putting the stock map back and logging to see if you can learn anything from that, and very importantly, seeking professional help with tuning your car. The current path is definitely not good.

I hope you are using 93 octane fuel... along with a 91 octane map, although that would make the logs even worse. Point is, your engine NEEDS 93 octane fuel. Do not try to use 91 out of economic considerations if 93 is available. You engine will not like that.