5EAT Ask your Questions!?!

[Mnabeih]

Yes you should. Not doing so will actually do MORE damage to the clutches because they will slip more.

 

If throttlehappy has them defined use his, if not let me know your rom ID and I'll find the calculated torque stuff for you.

 

I attached an LV with the rom id

[utc_pyro]

I attached an LV with the rom id

 

Hum... This one looks a little different than the others I've looked at. Maybe throttlehappy can chime in to confirm. Consider it alpha. There are some other tables in the ROM near this one that look like they are related, but no idea what they do.

 

For a2uh000a:

<table name="Calc Engine Torque" category="UTC_Pyro Alpha" address="C1F20" type="3D" level="1" scaling="RequestedTorque(rawecuvalue)">
   <description>Calculated Crank Engine Torque relative to Load (G/rev) vs RPM.</description>
   <table name="Engine Load" address="C1EA4" type="X Axis" elements="15" scaling="g/rev"/>
   <table name="Engine Speed" address="C1EE0" type="Y Axis" elements="16" scaling="RPM"/>
</table>

Edited August 2, 2016 by utc_pyro
table description

[utc_pyro]

Confirmed working on the A2WC521C

 

Could I convince you to find the timing retard tables too?

 

Do I have to?

 

	<table name="Ignition Timing Compensation Shift Retard" category="UTC_Pyro Beta" address="C99E0" type="2D" level="1" scaling="IgnitionTimingCorrection(degrees)">
	<table name="Accelerator Pedal Opening %" address="C99E0" type="Y Axis" elements="6" scaling="rawecuvalue"/>	
</table>

<scaling name="Timing Compensation Retard" units="degrees" toexpr="(x*0.3515625)-45" frexpr="(x+45)/0.3515625" format="%.2f" min="0" max="255" inc="1" storagetype="uint8" endian="big"/>

<table name="Ignition Timing Retard AT Gear A" category="UTC_Pyro Beta" address="c9a30" type="2D" level="1" scaling="Timing Compensation Retard">
	<table name="Pedal Angle" address="c9a10" type="X Axis" elements="8" scaling="rawecuvalue"/>
</table>

<table name="Ignition Timing Retard AT Gear B" category="UTC_Pyro Beta" address="c9a80" type="2D" level="1" scaling="Timing Compensation Retard">
	<table name="Pedal Angle" address="c9a60" type="X Axis" elements="8" scaling="rawecuvalue"/>
</table>

<table name="Ignition Timing Retard AT Gear C" category="UTC_Pyro Beta" address="c9ad0" type="2D" level="1" scaling="Timing Compensation Retard">
	<table name="Pedal Angle" address="c9ab0" type="X Axis" elements="8" scaling="rawecuvalue"/>
</table>

<table name="Ignition Timing Retard AT Gear D" category="UTC_Pyro Beta" address="c9b20" type="2D" level="1" scaling="Timing Compensation Retard">
	<table name="Pedal Angle" address="c9b00" type="X Axis" elements="8" scaling="rawecuvalue"/>
</table>

<table name="Ignition Timing Retard AT Gear E" category="UTC_Pyro Beta" address="c9b70" type="2D" level="1" scaling="Timing Compensation Retard">
	<table name="Pedal Angle" address="c9b50" type="X Axis" elements="8" scaling="rawecuvalue"/>
</table>

<table name="Ignition Timing Retard AT Gear F" category="UTC_Pyro Beta" address="c9bc0" type="2D" level="1" scaling="Timing Compensation Retard">
	<table name="Pedal Angle" address="c9ba0" type="X Axis" elements="8" scaling="rawecuvalue"/>
</table>

 

Consider these alpha as well as I haven't had a guinea pig yet. If you can go make a change and log total timing during shifts at different throttle settings so we can confirm.

[Mnabeih]

Hum... This one looks a little different than the others I've looked at. Maybe throttlehappy can chime in to confirm. Consider it alpha. There are some other tables in the ROM near this one that look like they are related, but no idea what they do.

 

For a2uh000a:

<table name="Calc Engine Torque A" category="UTC_Pyro Alpha" address="C1F20" type="3D" level="1" scaling="RequestedTorque(rawecuvalue)">
   <description>Calculated Crank Engine Torque relative to [Load (G/rev) * (RAW) Injector scaling] vs RPM.</description>
   <table name="Engine Load" address="C1EA4" type="X Axis" elements="15" scaling="g/rev"/>
   <table name="Engine Speed" address="C1EE0" type="Y Axis" elements="16" scaling="RPM"/>
</table>

 

Sorry, i send a wrong rom id,

I bought a vagcom cable and bring the rom id attached

4B04505107

[utc_pyro]

Sorry, i send a wrong rom id,

I bought a vagcom cable and bring the rom id attached

4B04505107

 

A2UH000A = 4B04505107

 

There are apparently two ways to identify a rom:

 

LID = A2UH000A (commonly used)

ECUID = 4B04505107

 

Add the XML to the A2UH000A.xml in your ECU flash directory and it should show up when you open the rom.

[whitrzac]

Confirmed working on the A2WC521C

 

Could I convince you to find the timing retard tables too?

 

 

I finaly have the car running at a higher boost level/correct.

 

Taking this table and multiplying it to get ~402 ish as the highest value made almost as much of a difference as the VB mod did:eek:

 

I haven't had time to try the timing retard tables.

[utc_pyro]

I haven't had time to try the timing retard tables.

 

Be careful with the retard tables as I havent been able to verify them. Cobb seems to think only one of them is used ("Ignition Timing Compensation Shift Retard"), but there is a lot of talk over on Romraider about the other sets for each gear. My car still isn't back from the shop after it's head gasket blowing intake tuning/leak adventure (3 months ) so I haven't been able to log them. For higher resolution I'd advise logging JUST the final timing/RPM/timing retard switches before and after to verify.

[fahr_side]

I'm also of the opinion that the one table affects all gear changes. This parameter is very useful on the 5th gens which we all know are prone to boost creep at stg2. Too much timing retard and the extra heat in the exhaust gas has boost spiking way high during the shift. Too little and it's hard on the clutches. Tweaking this one table is enough to get it right for all gears IME. Edited August 23, 2016 by fahr_side

[JMLegacy]

My experience with the ignition retard is that it causes clutches to slip. It's almost like not lifting off the gas pedal when shifting gears in a manual.

 

Do not modify that table without modifying the calculated torque and other necessary torque tables or at best a HEXAGRAM valve body mod.

Edited August 23, 2016 by JMLegacy

[fahr_side]

Oh I always tune RT and CT tables on automatics.

[snow05gtRI]

 

 

I finaly have the car running at a higher boost level/correct.

 

Taking this table and multiplying it to get ~402 ish as the highest value made almost as much of a difference as the VB mod did:eek:

 

I haven't had time to try the timing retard tables.

 

did you scale by the ratio of the change in injector size?

[JMLegacy]

Oh I always tune RT and CT tables on automatics.

 

I know YOU would , but just putting it out for the others who wanna try on their own

[I3eXa]

All this talk makes me wanna tune myself. Just no time to learn

 

 

Sent from your bedroom closet ]-.-[

[whitrzac]

Oh I always tune RT and CT tables on automatics.

 

Up until recently the CT table was not defined for the 05-07 models.

 

did you scale by the ratio of the change in injector size?

 

 

Nope. More= better.

[fahr_side]

Up until recently the CT table was not defined for the 05-07 models.

Perhaps, but the '10~ 5EAT and most 4EAT defs have been public for ages. I work on a lot of 5EAT (EDM) 5th gens and 4EAT Foresters. Note also that many things are defined, in testing, but not yet released in the public domain

 

 

Nope. More= better.

 

 

Mmm. You can go too far. Too much CT at low rpm / load seems to cause issues with lurching shifts, odd converter lock-up behavior or 'shuttle shifting'. Too much toward redline can put the transmission shift point beyond redline so you hit the rev limiter first and the trans doesn't shift up at all. Too much in the midrange / lower load can cause overly aggressive downshift behavior. It's not a table you can just paste 512 across all cells or just bump the whole thing up until the last column has 400 in it and expect to call it good

Edited August 24, 2016 by fahr_side

[JMLegacy]

Can anyone here do a log for me brake-boosting and lauch at 3000 rpm?

3000 is safe enough, over 3500 and 4k you more likely have to have the brass bushing

 

Log Engine speed, Boost, MAF g/s, and volumetric efficency if you have it. Thanks.

 

Trying to see how the 2.0 compares to the 2.5 while doing that.

 

EDIT: Got the info I needed. 90 something g/s

Edited August 29, 2016 by JMLegacy

[I3eXa]

Can anyone here do a log for me brake-boosting and lauch at 3000 rpm?

 

Log Engine speed, Boost, MAF g/s, and volumetric efficency if you have it. Thanks.

 

 

 

Trying to see how the 2.0 compares to the 2.5 while doing that.

 

 

 

I'd rather not and keep my transmission operational

 

 

Sent from your bedroom closet ]-.-[

[JMLegacy]

About launching again. Let me see if i understand this. So the launch from the sudden shock of torque through the diff is what cause the needle bearings to flex beyond an acceptable measure, and cause gears to break? Or just the sheer power causing it to flex whether we release hard or gently?

 

If that is so, what about stalling and letting go the brake for a softer rollingesque launch like EVO guys?

Edited September 15, 2016 by JMLegacy

[utc_pyro]

So the launch from the sudden shock of torque through the diff is what cause the needle bearings to flex beyond an acceptable measure, and cause gears to break? Or just the sheer power causing it to flex whether we release hard or gently?

 

Probably both. I shattered mine one night after launching from stops lights, but not break launching. There are a few videos floating around of people break launching at drag strips and shattering it before even moving. In my case it was probably shock loading during a shifts with an over agreeive valve body. The damage was done and it let go while I was gently pulling away from a gas pump. In the videos it was likely due to total torque at that instant.

[kzr750r1]

GO get a manual car. Your only asking for destruction with this line of questioning.

[seabass07]

Has anyone with the solid bushings had failures?

[JMLegacy]

Has anyone with the solid bushings had failures?

Far side had failures. But his torque is through the roof with ls swap engine I believe.

[JMLegacy]

GO get a manual car. Your only asking for destruction with this line of questioning.

 

I don't see anything wrong with investigating among ourselves to better understand this transmission...

Just like the evo guys figured their transfer case will not break if they roll off.

 

What i'm figuring with my question, is that if i move off more gently and at a lower rpm (And yes a bit slower), then I might preserve my center diff.

 

 

Btw guys, are you aware of a 3.9 final ratio for this transmission? This guy over russia claimed to use a 5eat out of a spec B and his speedo does reflect 3.9 final ratio

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j1aQoyML9Ug&t=0s]Subaru legacy b4 bl5 gt (spec b) 0-170 acceleration - YouTube[/ame]

 

2nd gear, 7000rpm, 90km/h

[kzr750r1]

I get you. All fine and good. As for rolling it on (off) is likely a better scenario that a break stand for the front diff. Potential energy loaded on those poor needle bearings can never be good, hence the bushing mod.

[utc_pyro]

There are tables (at least in the USDM ECU) you can use to limit the boost below a certain speed. If you want to brake launch you could probably set the speed limit to ~10MPH and the boost to wastegate. Not sure what other logic this might mess up, but it's worth looking at.

 

In addition to the GM motored beast, Climber.D has stated that several other people have broken them with the reinforcements. The next weak spot is the input-output shafts and the gears themselves. Thus why he sell cryo-treated version.