jp928 Posted June 25, 2005 Share Posted June 25, 2005 Can this be done much, and what does it take please? The gate seems a bit too vague for my liking, its a bit too easy to get wrong gear sometimes. 5 to 4 is a bit mushy seems to me - am I pushing it too much, or does anybody else feel this way?I dont necessarily want to reduce throws, but not averse to that. Is this where changing the shift bush comes in, or is it all part and parcel of a short shifter?Are there two bushes involved - one at the lever to shaft, and another on the back of something underneath?TIAjp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSiWRX Posted June 25, 2005 Share Posted June 25, 2005 Kartboy bushings seems to be a favorite - search unger "shifter bushing," and you should get great results and even walkl-through guides. After the rifle-bolt feel of my B&M on my TSi, I'm thinking about doing the bushings on my STi short-throw equipped LGT. Then again, my TSi responded best to hard shifts - the LGT seems to want softer shifts. Not slower shifts, mind you, but just "holding-an-egg" motions with the shift knob, easily guiding in up- and down-shifts. Hope this helps. -A <-- I love Winky, my "periwinkle" (ABP) LGT! - Allen / Usual Suspect "DumboRAT" / One of the Three Stooges '16 Outback, '16 WRX, 7th Subaru Family Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iyamdman Posted June 25, 2005 Share Posted June 25, 2005 I have the same issues. I am thinking of: a) Kartboy bushings b) Changing to Specialty Formulations Inc. synthetic fluids, MTL-R for the trans, and HDS-5 for the rear diff. - http://www.specialtyformulations.com I am hoping this reasonably priced mod will really "clean-up" the shifting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Levish Posted June 27, 2005 Share Posted June 27, 2005 The Shifter bushings + the Solid Tranny mount from the STI will make things about as perfect as they can be with the Legacy. I do get a bit of noise/vibration/harshness with it just installed which may go away (just had the work done). Perhaps there just needs to be some sort of a gasket Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canis Posted June 27, 2005 Share Posted June 27, 2005 The Legacy's shifting does have some mush in it. This can be greatly reduced with the STS and bushings, but it's still there. I agree that the Legacy favors softer shifts. And I also agree that 4-5 is just yuck. I've also noticed that you as the driver can play a big part. If I'm just being stoopid with the radio up and rowing gears, there are a lot of ugly shifts. But if I turn the radio off, concentrate and "feel" the car, the rev-matching and driver-induced syncronization are much more accurate and the car shifts fairly well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Levish Posted June 27, 2005 Share Posted June 27, 2005 The solid STI mount really did firm things up a lot but @ this moment there is too much noise for me and am either going to try having my mechanic put in some sort of rubber gasket in between the solid mount or replace the oem mount. Pity because it really cleaned up one of my major gripes with regards to shifting which I thought was related to the drive by wire system Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iyamdman Posted June 27, 2005 Share Posted June 27, 2005 Yeah, I thought about the STI mount, but thought I will try the bushings and oil and see what that does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jp928 Posted June 27, 2005 Author Share Posted June 27, 2005 So which bushing are we talking here guys? I have seen pics of one at the rear of a rod with the rod sliding horizontally, and another donut shaped thing that goes on a stay or steady? thanks, jp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bemani Posted June 28, 2005 Share Posted June 28, 2005 donut Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmorris Posted June 28, 2005 Share Posted June 28, 2005 Do them both, alone I don't think they make enough improvement. I installed mine seperately and it all came together when I installed the rear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fzanetti Posted June 28, 2005 Share Posted June 28, 2005 So do you guys really think after the Short Shifter or Kartboy, bushings and trannie mount, the Legacy would be as close as it gets to an STi shifting???? Any words on that? Tx Flavio Zanetti Boston, MA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abakja1 Posted June 28, 2005 Share Posted June 28, 2005 I first installed my Kartboy shifter,..Throws were a lot shorter, but the "direct-ness" of the shifts were iffy,..especially 2nd to 3rd for me as I was shifting too far to the right,... With the Kartboy bushings in the front, the "feel" are a lot more improved and I have hardly no doubts getting into gear,.. 4th to 5th too is a bit long for me too and not great,.. But this is a "HUGH" improvement over my DSM or 90 Eclipse GSX with short shifter and mods,..BG Synchroshift and all the bushings are still no match to the Subie, maybe cause it was cable driven??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBT Posted June 28, 2005 Share Posted June 28, 2005 The Legacy STI STS will get you as close to the STI as you can get. The bushings are harder and less compliant than the stock bushings (probably on the order of the KB or Cusco ones) with less NVH than either the KB or the Cusco IMHE. Incidently, there is no forward/aft adjustment on the shifter, I asked already, so as some have mentioned, learn to hear/feel the shift points. I find that with the STI STS, the rubbery-ness is gone and the gates are more "slotted". Another part of the shift smoothness is attributable, I think, to locking yourself into the driving position so when you're downshifting as you're powering through a turn or making a quick jog left/right, 90 degree, etc., you're not physically sliding in/out, back and forth in the seat. All that motion tends to make you mentally recalibrate (or not) your shift throws, and un-gates the shifter from its intended path as it wobbles around on the end of your hand. A good shift knob can help here too, particularly something like this Momo Cobra knob... http://store1.yimg.com/I/ltbmotorsport_1849_1769901 that keeps you connected and helps apply the appropriate leverage angle during up and down shifts. I have this on my 98 LGT and really like it a lot. More info on the Momo Cobra here... http://www.ltbmotorsports.com/index.html FWIW - I think you can be equally as happy with the KB shifter as with the STI STS, just "learn" the shift patterns, gate lengths for each and drive accordingly. SBT SBT - Pro amore Dei et patriam et populum - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iyamdman Posted June 28, 2005 Share Posted June 28, 2005 I was thinking about both bushings - since you got rip it all apart - might as well do it all. I am still thinking about the STS - I am OK with the stock one, the long throws it not a problem for me, and I like the knob higher since I like to rest my hand on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MUD Posted June 28, 2005 Share Posted June 28, 2005 I plan to order (again....*curseword*) the KartBoy STS w/ bushings next pay-day. For those who're having trouble with the 2nd to 3rd *quick* shift.....you can try what I've been doing. It seems to shorten as well as ease the shift.....atleast that's what I've been telling myself! HaHa! When hard accelerating with the intent to shift from 2nd to 3rd w/ a quickness......pull the lever out of 2nd and beifly (quickly) allow the shifter to hit it's natural neutral position (as in... let go of the knob!), once that's done.....use FINESS to gently guide it into 3rd! It may take a couple tries to get it.....so start by using ONLY your THUMB to put in 3rd! This helped me. As far as 5th - 4th.....I'm still working on that disaster. TI-FWIW! It is the disposition of men to desire that which he cannot have, hence my un-quenchable wet desire for Shakira! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scans007 Posted June 28, 2005 Share Posted June 28, 2005 Def get 1) STS (I have cobbs) 2) Bushings 3) The right shift knob - I've switch mine 3 times and now have the perfect knob and it DID make a diff and i still dont believe it. After driv'n PLtek's car I loved his knob (EASY FELLAS) and went and got one for myself, my shift became smoother just from it. Still cant' believe it. This is where I am now and there is a HUGE diff from stock Next I wanna finish up with 4) Tranny Fluid 5) Tranny Mount As for the quick shift, it's def fun....I can now hit from 2 - 3, 3 - 4, 4 - 5, 4 - 3, with some consistancy...still shouldn't be do'n it it's not that hard to push in the clutch ....LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fzanetti Posted June 28, 2005 Share Posted June 28, 2005 Subietonic... Thanks for those words man.... Helped a lot in my mind what I am trying to accomplish... Have read several people comparing the STS and KB, and they were preferring the latter more than the former, for some reason, which it might just be preference or technical quality and precision, can you spare some words on that comparision as well? Sorry for asking too much, thanks in advance, Flavio Zanetti Boston, MA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scans007 Posted June 28, 2005 Share Posted June 28, 2005 Subietonic... Thanks for those words man.... Helped a lot in my mind what I am trying to accomplish... Have read several people comparing the STS and KB, and they were preferring the latter more than the former, for some reason, which it might just be preference or technical quality and precision, can you spare some words on that comparision as well? Sorry for asking too much, thanks in advance, Flavio Zanetti Boston, MA You should swing by and take mine for a ride to feel just an STS with Bushings and see for yourself how it compares And did you mean the STi and KB ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fzanetti Posted June 28, 2005 Share Posted June 28, 2005 Definately Scans007... I meant STi Short Shifter versus the Kartboy, saw on the forums a while ago, people comparing them and preferring the KB more than the STi SS... So I wanted to know exactly why... I am also planning on either COBB or KB and bushings, trannie mount and synthetic fluid flush both for trannie and differential... ;-) Flavio Zanetti Boston, MA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scans007 Posted June 28, 2005 Share Posted June 28, 2005 In short, no pun intended, the STI STS wasn't a short enought throw for me,was way too much $$, and was a much more complicated install..... those were the reasons for me when I was comparing them all... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmorris Posted June 29, 2005 Share Posted June 29, 2005 I have the STi because I put it in before the others were released or at least before I knew the others existed. It is definately not all that short and the bushings are no harder than the stock bushings...the KB bushing still made a huge improvement. I also switched to Specialty Formulations fluid which helped quite a bit on the smoothness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSiWRX Posted July 5, 2005 Share Posted July 5, 2005 For those who're having trouble with the 2nd to 3rd *quick* shift.....you can try what I've been doing. It seems to shorten as well as ease the shift.....atleast that's what I've been telling myself! HaHa! When hard accelerating with the intent to shift from 2nd to 3rd w/ a quickness......pull the lever out of 2nd and beifly (quickly) allow the shifter to hit it's natural neutral position (as in... let go of the knob!), once that's done.....use FINESS to gently guide it into 3rd! It may take a couple tries to get it.....so start by using ONLY your THUMB to put in 3rd! This helped me. As far as 5th - 4th.....I'm still working on that disaster. Me too - for 4th-5th. --- As far as 2nd-3rd goes, I tend to simply guide the stick with my slightly cupped palm. Any attempt by me to physically manhandle the stick in to the 2nd/3rd transition results in a missed shift. With only such a guide, handling the knob as an egg, I can slap off shifts just as fast as in my "rifle-bolt" modified DSM, only much more smoothly to-boot. And I totally agree - guys and glas, get out there and find a shift knob that works for you. Even a few millimeters' reduction in physical stalk height or a few grams difference in weight can make a huge difference - so can the physical texture of the knob. I'm one of the lucky few for which the factory USDM knob simply is the best fit. -A <-- I love Winky, my "periwinkle" (ABP) LGT! - Allen / Usual Suspect "DumboRAT" / One of the Three Stooges '16 Outback, '16 WRX, 7th Subaru Family Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Levish Posted July 5, 2005 Share Posted July 5, 2005 Depending on how short you have your throw set to, you may or may not have this trouble. I'm pretty happy with my shift knob, I traced some of the noise issues, they were due to the upper shift rod hitting the surrounding metal bracket in a few of the gears. Still a quite a bit of noise coming through with the sti tranny mount but I guess that can't be helped. maybe I'll just cut up my own gasket out of a rubber sheet or live with it. On another note, now with the shifter aligned to prevent the above problem it doesn't sit squarely in the opening (sits far back when in 2nd,4th and Reverse). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KegTapper Posted July 5, 2005 Share Posted July 5, 2005 Quick question - does the installation of the aforementioned shifter bushings require access through the inside of the car (pull out shifter) or will I need to get under the vehicle? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBT Posted July 5, 2005 Share Posted July 5, 2005 Quick question - does the installation of the aforementioned shifter bushings require access through the inside of the car (pull out shifter) or will I need to get under the vehicle? It's under the vehicle and on the driver's side of the car between the transmission and the exhaust piping. It can be a beyotch to get to but with patience and a cool exhaust (a must) it's bearable. Check out this link...http://www.scoobymods.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3791 Believe this is for a Forester install but the process is the same. SBT - Pro amore Dei et patriam et populum - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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