2nd Gen Engine FAQ - Turbos - MPG - Engine Builds - Engine Swaps - Engine Management

[Zues Marine]

but the ej25de's do not, but yes... at/mt ID pin... #81

[86bratman]

My buddy has a 97 5MT GT, my car is running an ecu out of a 98 auto Forester. Same part number on the ecu's.

[Zues Marine]

i was talking about the jdm ecu for the 25de

[R1S1]

Hello gents,

 

I have 2gen Legacy TwinTurbo and now I would like to ask which ecu produce more power and which is better. Because I have both of them, tried to swap them, but i didn't feel any difference (maybe dyno would feel smth...) And if there is a possibility to increase power by chipping them.

 

So my question is:

Which ecu is better (more power) and ofcourse I want to know all additional information you know about them

8C 22611 AB394 A18-000 DD0

 

and

 

T5 22611 AB391 A18-000 RS5

 

Waiting for your proffesional responses, thanks.

[Sludgeroo]

The thing is, a lot of us here are in the US and that engine option wasn't an option.

 

So the information from the guys on here may be limited. There are some guys who aren't stateside and have had an RS or GTB and may shed better light on this.

 

May I recommend maybe go to a subaru dealer in the area And have them cross reference ECU codes and see if they can pull more info..

 

 

Only guys on here that have the twin turbo 2 liter have swapped then and chances are they run aftermarket/standalone ECUs.

 

Sent from my VS980 4G using Tapatalk

[R1S1]

The thing is, a lot of us here are in the US and that engine option wasn't an option.

 

So the information from the guys on here may be limited. There are some guys who aren't stateside and have had an RS or GTB and may shed better light on this.

 

May I recommend maybe go to a subaru dealer in the area And have them cross reference ECU codes and see if they can pull more info..

 

 

Only guys on here that have the twin turbo 2 liter have swapped then and chances are they run aftermarket/standalone ECUs.

 

Sent from my VS980 4G using Tapatalk

 

Well, thats a point, that I'am from Europe and I have modified JDM subaru by changing side of the steering wheel and I asked already subaru dealer, but they know only about european models...

So I thought, that there are some more freaks like me and have the same project as mine or driving illeagal with strange-located steering wheel like British, Japaneese or Australian

[Sludgeroo]

You need to talk to Dave from FAST of Westchester. He swapped a firewall from a JDM clip...

 

He knows a bunch. Is on here from time to time.

 

His car is absolutely nuts too

 

Sent from my VS980 4G using Tapatalk

[Zues Marine]

uklegacy.com

those guys know allllll about the 20tt

[ruckus00]

I have a JDM twin turbo engine that has a major knock now. I would like to fix it, cheap and easily. What are some suggestions? Where do I get parts for this engine? Thank you

[Sludgeroo]

See above

 

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[boattlebot]

Just to verify.... any ej will bolt into our 2nd gens right? Any year restrictions or somethinlike that? I found a 2011 wrx or sti, I cant tell witch.the bodys wrecked to bad but it starts and I might pick it up for a swap

[Samuel Edmondson]

G'day, I'm Sam from Australia. I have a 1998 Subaru Liberty (Legacy) GX with a Ej22 2.2L engine. I've been thinking about swapping it for a 2.5 or higher, any ideas?

[98legacycarl]

I have a 98 legacy outback with ej25 and the motor is bad, i was wondering if i swapped it out for a ej20 or ej22 is it a direct replacement or will i have alot of work? trying to see if its worth it or just going with ej25 again, just want a realiable motor, thanks

[Aquiniano]

So just out of curiosity, if I plan on going the hybrid route, and am currently running a 95 Dual port EJ22E, and want to swap in EJ205 heads... What will I need?

Obviously the Ecu, and wiring, luckily iWire is down the street from me. But yes, what else is needed? I'm planning on going for low boost for now too, nothing too high.

 

Thanks!

-Anthony

[red98legacyoutback]

TURBO FAQ

 

I've seen and answered countless questions about turbo charging the second generation Subaru Legacy. I'm putting together this FAQ to help clear up some of these questions.

 

If I have missed anything, please feel free to suggest something for me to add to this FAQ. I will edit it as I see fit.

 

Wiring Harness Merge - HOW TO

 

Can I turbo charge my Legacy?

Short answer is no, you can not. However, keep reading and I will explain ways that you are able to have boost in your car.

Why can't I turbo charge my car?

I can go on for days explaining this. However I'll try to keep it short and to the point. The EJ25D is an open deck engine. It is NOT a strong engine and does not handle boost well. There have been people who have been able to run about 4 - 5psi on them though. This is typical for a TD04 turbo, and to be honest isn't enough power for the money you will spend doing it. You also run into other problems like weak internals and compression ratio. The EJ22E is a little bit of a stronger engine and can handle about 10psi, however the money thing comes into play here as well. You can do a swap for just a little more then it will cost you to boost your EJ22E and have considerably more power.

What about the JDM second generation Legacys? They are twin turbo!

Unlike our USDM Legacys, the JDM Subaru Legacy has an engine designed to withstand the extra power of the turbos. The EJ20R has forged internals, and VERY good heads...

I've seen Legacys online that have a turbo. How did they do it?

Most people do some kind of WRX or STI swap. This includes just about all of the WRX / STI guts. Engine, transmission, rear diff, ecu, wiring, subframe, etc. I'll go into more details later on.

What other options do I have besides a WRX or STI swap?

There are a few other options out there. Most of the JDM drivetrains can be bought on Ebay for a reasonable price. Personally, I'm running an EJ20R setup with a stand alone ECU. You can also use the older USDM Turbo Legacy engines.

What about my transmission?

The 4EAT and the 5MT are not strong transmissions. They do excellent under stock horsepower, but when you start adding the power of forced induction to them...they don't last for very long. They may work for a little while, but they will have severe problems A LOT sooner then then should.

So if my transmission isn't strong enough, what should I do?

The easiest thing to do is to find a wrecked donor car. Or you can find a transmission / rear diff combo online. I'm currently running a JDM STI v3 5 speed with a stage 1 clutch. Its good up until about 400awhp.

What about my exhaust? I've installed a turbo engine and I can't make the exhaust fit around the subframe. It looks like I have to cut part of it out!

Our stock subframes were not designed to accomadate for the turbo exhaust. The work around for this is to either use an 04 STI or any 02-07 WRX subframe. DO NOT cut your stock subframe. It will not be as strong as it needs to be if you do this. You can also run any of the USDM turbo Legacy subframes.

So can you just give me a quick list of the parts I need to do a turbo swap?

This depends on what route you go. If you do a WRX / STI swap, you will need the following

 

• Engine
  
  
• Transmission
  
  
• ECU
  
  
• Wiring
  
  
• Rear Diff
  
  
• Turbo
  
  
• Exhaust
  
  
• Subframe
  
  
• Custom Driveshaft
  
  

 

If you do some kind of JDM swap, you will need all the same stuff listed, except you will not be able to run a stock ECU. With a JDM swap, your best bet is a stand alone ecu system like AEM or Megasquirt. Piggyback systems are an option, but are more trouble then its worth.

So I did a JDM swap with a stand alone ECU, but my car doesn't run right. What do I do?

You need to get your car dyno tuned at this point. Every ECU has parameters and settings for the engine to run within. With any kind of stand alone ECU, you have to "tune" these settings to your specific setup. Its not hard to do, its just hard to get it right. If you screw up when you do it, it will cost you your engine. If you really did a swap and didn't know the answer to this, you should probably build model cars instead.

I want to do a swap, but I'm concerned about my stock axles. Will they be able to handle the extra power of a turbo engine?

You should be fine within reason. You're not going to be able to put 500awhp to stock axles, but the 200awhp area is fine on stock Legacy axles. A decent upgrade is STI or WRX axles. They are able to handle a little more abuse then the Legacy parts.

I want the EJ20R twin turbo JDM engine in my car! It will bolt right up....right?

Wrong. Its VERY difficult to run the twin turbo setup on our USDM Legacys. The reason for this is the difference between right and left hand drive. Our steering linkage, brake booster, etc gets in the way of the second turbo. I have seen a USDM Impreza run the twin turbo EJ20R, but they had to heavily modify it. My personal EJ20R has been converted to a single rotated turbo. I HIGHLY recommend the EJ20R because its an excellent engine, but expect to NOT have a twin turbo system with it.

So whats the hardest part about doing a turbo swap?

The wiring in our cars is a nightmare. If you do a WRX / STI swap with the WRX / STI ECU, you have to "splice" the stock Legacy wiring harness, and the WRX harness together. If you run a stand alone ECU, you will have to make a custom wiring harness. Trust me, there are A LOT of wires.

I chose to do a WRX / STI swap, but I want a little more power out of the stock WRX / STI drivetrain. What can I do?

Before you start upgrading the stock WRX / STI setup, you should look into some kind of piggyback system like a CobbAP. This way, you're able to tune your car to whatever mods you have installed and get all the power out of it. After a piggyback, you can do a rotated turbo setup with something bigger then the TD04 or VF39. Bigger injectors, exhaust, MSD, boost controller, etc are all good upgrades.

I always look on my local Craigslist classifieds for a wrecked WRX / STI, but I never see one. Where can I find one at?

The best places to look are local Subaru forums, NASIOC, and car auctions.

I want to use X block with X heads for my turbo build. Can I do this?

YES! This is whats known as a "hybrid" build. Usually, you can pair any EJ series head with any EJ series engine. I would recommend using ARP head studs if you plan on running a lot of boost.

I'm going to install a WRX engine, but I want to use the STI 6 speed transmission. Is this possible?

Yes it is. Just like the heads, you can mix-match engines/transmissions. Transmission mounts may be different for each transmission however. The STI 6 speed has the DCCD that will need to be wired in though, and I'm not sure how to do it...but I do know that it has been done on our cars.

Can I use my stock Legacy clutch?

Probably. I would suggest otherwise though. It will likely shatter on launch or slip under power.

What about gas mileage after a turbo swap?

Your gas mileage will suffer some. I know our cars are not the most fuel efficient cars on the road already....but any time you add more power to a vehicle, it gets worse gas mileage. My Legacy turbo isn't THAT bad on gas. The worst part of is is that I have to run 93 octane.

What else do you suggest?

I suggest some suspension and brake work to be done with your swap. If you're anything like I am, you take advantage of the AWD system and haul *ss through the corners. Now that you have more power under the hood, you're going to be able to come into these corners a lot faster. Better suspension and better brakes are a MUST. I have WRX brakes and D2 Racing coilovers. I'm pretty happy with the suspension, however I am wanting to upgrade the brakes even more so then they already are.

What is your current turbo setup?

I have a 1995 Subaru Legacy L. It has the JDM EJ20R engine in it paired with the JDM STI v3 5 speed and a limited slip rear diff. I have a Megasquirt stand alone ecu, port/polished heads, 252 cams, upgraded fuel pump, MSD, 660 injectors, front mount intercooler, rotated TD04, full 3 inch turbo-back exhaust, etc. I'm happy with my current setup, but its only good up until about 400awhp.

There isn't much space under my hood. Are you sure all this turbo stuff will fit?

Yes it will fit

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v287/broknindarkagain/LegacySTI/199555_10150150413543326_605068325_6516934_7951161_n.jpg

 

Mechanically, you can bolt up any EJ series engine to any EJ series transmission, and drop the two into any car that was designed with any EJ series engine.

 

 

 

This is true, however you can use the EJ20R on left hand drive Subarus if you convert it to a single turbo setup. This will require using any stock or aftermarket WRX exhaust. The twin turbo setup does not fit around our left hand drive steering rack and linkage. It can be made to work with heavy custom modifications though, but doesn't seem to be worth the trouble.

 

 

The following is a list of Subaru EJ Turbo Charged engines that are able to fit into the second generation Legacy / Outback / Impreza

 

2.0L Single Turbo

-

EJ20G

JDM 93-96 STI, WRX 92-96

-

EJ20K

JDM 97-99 STI

-

EJ205

JDM 99-01 WRX Wagon, 01-11 WRX, USDM 02-05 WRX

-

EJ207

JDM 98-11 STI

2.0L Twin Turbo must be converted to single turbo

-

EJ20H

JDM 93-98 Legacy

-

EJ20R

JDM 96-98 Legacy

-

EJ206

JDM 98-03 Legacy

-

EJ208

JDM 98-03 Legacy

2.2L Single Turbo

-

EJ22T

USDM 90-94 Legacy

-

EJ22G

JDM Impreza STI GC8

2.5L Single Turbo

-

EJ255

USDM 06-11 Impreza, 04-11 Forester, 03-11 Legacy, 04-06 Baja

-

EJ257

USDM 04-11 STI

 

 

 

 

EDIT :

 

If you're needing the FSM - look here http://www.sl-i.net/FORUM/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=20753

 

A good read about swaps http://www.modified.com/tech/0403scc_subaru_gbd_wrx_engine/index.html

 

 

Do you happen to know what subframe I would need to turbo swap a 1998 legacy outback?

[broknindarkagain]

Do you happen to know what subframe I would need to turbo swap a 1998 legacy outback?

 

You can use a subframe from any Subaru that has a turbo EJ engine.

[WedgedPine]

So after reading this it answered a lot of my questions but I've still got a couple things I'd like to clear up.

For one I've got a 97 jdm gtb legacy with a twin turbo ej20k in it right now. The connecting rod bearings are on their way out and I wanna replace it with an ej20r. Will the ecu be compatable or will I run into issues? Also after reading this I'm assuming till bolt right into my tranny as you stated above. Any help I'd appreciated!

[pim]

I have a 280hp 1998 engine , sinds last week when i start the car in the morning and put it in the gear it move just a little bit not more than 5 km/h , no power at all , after 10 minutes when engine is on temperature it start driving normal .

Anyone knows this problem ?

Thanks in advance !