DIY: Rough idle in cold start/cold temps LGT 07-09

[slowGT]

Do you know if this is only specific to 2007-2009? This sounds exactly like what my 05 LGT has been doing for years. Never stalls or throws a code, but almost stalls out when it is cold outside and the engine has not fully warmed up yet and I am in stop-and-go traffic. Idles fine though.

 

Are the gaskets the same for the 05 to the 07? Or did they change some small thing that makes them different? I have actually had the code for the TGV's twice since I got the car (both 50k miles or more ago) and fixed under warranty. Wonder if they screwed up the gaskets, didn't put new ones in, or what. They just said they "cleaned the intake manifold and TGV valves". Might look into this as the problem seems to be getting worse as the years go by (feels more and more like it really will stall), and it does it with warmer outside temps now (used to be if it was freezing or below, no it will do it if it in the 40's).

 

Thanks,

Neil

 

Yes, this part number works for 05 GT's. I would guess that this will fix your problem.

 

I bought the car at 30K. I always had a miss/hesitation to it. Read this and changed them out yesterday. What a night and day difference in the car.

 

I would strongly suggest anyone who thinks that their car may not be 100% try this fix first. Don't jump to plugs, and a hundred other things first. For $25 how can you go wrong??

 

Thanks to the OP!

[Max Capacity]

Did this job on the 05 Saturday. We didn't remove the intake just removed the required nuts and bolts to lift either side enough to use needle nose plies to gently pull/wiggle the old ones down and out. Then installed the new ones and lowered that side then did the other side. I also zip tied the vacuume hose as needed. The one next to the hose for the brake booster from the intake to be exact. I have zip tied the others before.

 

Haven't started the car yet, the tranny's still out, that's a different thread.

 

But these new o-rings are much bigger.

Edited December 10, 2011 by Max Capacity

[bmx045]

Yeah this job doesn't require removing the manifold. I had to zip tie the bpv vac hose at the back of the manifold at 18psi because it kept blowing off.

[Nrw]

Well I hope no one needs help from the OP

[gessvt]

Tried to replace the gaskets (2005 LGT) in my driveway this weekend. Best of luck getting the wiring harness bracket removed from the manifold. Even with the intercooler out of the way, there's barely any room to get an open ended wrench in there. In addition, the hoses that are routed underneath the bracket on the passenger side are packed in so tight I had no idea where to start with them. This isn't an easy DIY by any stretch of the imagination.

[bmx045]

welp......I mentioned this process as 07+ LGT, so your differences may vary.....either way, it's still very possible to do in your driveway.

[rockford33]

Well, finally got this done (just in time for a warm spell to hit....). Not cold enough now to tell if it has/will make a difference, but shouldn't be too long before it does get cold again. These o-rings are a night and day difference from what was in there though. The old gaskets were shorter and the edges were rounded, and they looked like they sat flush with the manifold when tucked up in place. The new ones were taller, square edges, and stuck out of the manifold a little when seated.

 

-Neil

[finboy]

shrinkage type cold weather = lousy idle and flashing dash lights

 

for those who took it to the dealer, other than them pulling the codes

what does the mechanic do to check for intake leaks?

[bmx045]

spray carb cleaner in the suspected area while the engine is running and see if the idle increases.

[joop1987]

I got the pleasure to replace my O rings today. I thought the front drivers side was impossible. I found it much easier with the air pump removed, the air pump bracket removed, and remove the bolt holding the metal shield (see yellow arrow below). The only way to put the O ring in is from the front (where the air pump used to be). Took 2 hrs.

 

http://img502.imageshack.us/img502/6899/asdfpr.jpg

 

http://img7.imageshack.us/img7/1104/img20120107142521.jpg

Edited January 9, 2012 by joop1987

[bmx045]

nice, i did the same with my secondary air pump setup...

[Wagonation]

Would it be possible to get the original pics back up?

 

I have a strange hollow intake sound on my mostly stock 05 lgt at 2400-2500 rpm that I think may be related to these faulty/old intake manifold o-rings. I also have a rough idle. The exhaust was thoroughly checked when I put on a catless uppipe and turbo and the sound remains.

[spec.B Dream]

The original pics might help, but the gaskets are different on the 05-06, not the rings that the 07-09 have.

[bmx045]

for whatever reason the gmail photo section no longer allows hosting! wtf

[joop1987]

If you still have the pictures try imageshack http://imageshack.us/

[20lgt06]

going to do this today-- been getting misfire on 4- thanks for the write up.

[joe sko]

Did this today. Took a little over two hours with the help of a friend. Dental picks are almost a must. They definately made the process a lot easier.

[finboy]

Took my car in, they want to put a new O2 sensor in it

 

The idle and cel lights are cold weather sensitive

 

O2 sensor aint weather sensitive

 

How does one sell them to swap the gaskets?

[joe sko]

If you are still under warranty i would just print out this thread and the other good ones on here reagrding the rough idle and take them with you to the dealership. Maybe then they would see that it is a problem since it seems that almost all of the lgts from 07-09 have the problem. And the ones that it hasn't happened to yet it probably will. And they revised the gasket (so SOA knows its a problem.)

[20lgt06]

Still have the cell light on swapped everything out on cylinder 4 compression test is next:mad:

[paycer]

*disclaimer*

 

This post is from a frustrated 08 owner that has been trying to get his dealer to fix this glitch for over a year now. Reading this post will either put you to sleep, make you feel better about your own car situation, help you deal with your own dealer on this issue or get you to respond with "Cool story bro", "Shut Up Man!" or "why didn't you just fix it yourself?" The answer to the last one is that after spending (financing!) $32K on a car for my wife, it might be nice is Subaru would get it to run correctly... I mean they did redesign those intake gaskets so there MUST have been something wrong with the first ones yes?

 

*end disclaimer*

 

I've been following along with this thread for months, but I've been taking the car to my dealer for a "fix" since the car was under 36K when mine started throwing a CEL. I figured I would take advantage of the warranty that I paid for in the price of the car...Talk about a frustrating experience!

 

Here's my "fun" in a nutshell:

 

1. Over a year ago, below zero weather in Nebraska and a, misfire CEL shows up, dealer says it's a loose fuel hose and the issue is resolved.

 

-the weather warms up, I forget about the issue.

 

2. The weather gets cold again and I print another (older) thread (this one didn't exist yet) and put in the passenger seat with a example pic of the 350Z intake manifold and gaskets showing and don't mention a word of it to the dealer.

 

- the dealer says that an intercooler intake elbow (front lower right side) is torn and they replaced it under "goodwill" and the issue resolved. BTW, the service writer says, it WASN'T the intake gaskets. Remember, that I had never even mentioned intake gaskets but just left the printed out thread on the passenger seat. I leave feeling like a tool for leaving the info on the seat, but I trust the dealership's techs and leave.

 

-intermission from the dealer service bay-(2b).

 

Spring arrives days after the above fix and warmer weather shows up. The car behaves just fine until a groaning sound is heard coming from under the hood under acceleration. I read up on LGT.com to determine the issue and discover that the rubber sleeves in both ends of the replacment IC elbow fixed in #2 above tend to fail and let pressured air past making that groaning sound under acceleration. Many people complain the glue that holds the little end sleeves on is crap and to remove the sleeves and use a "T-Bar" hose clamp to eliminate the boot issue and upgrade from crapper worm and roller (OEM) hose clamps to more solid solution with the T-bar clamp. Me=losing faith in the dealer and not wanting to hassle with not having a car for awhile decide to fix it myself, by removing the rubber boots and using a T-Bar clamp. After my "fix" the sound goes away.

 

3. the temps drop again this year to around the zero mark and the CEL comes back along with accompanied crappy idle that has been present each time the CEL has illuminated. My wife's 08 spec.B (the car I've been yacking about) is now around 36K so I take the car in for the third time in hopes of not having to deal with an expired bumper to bumper warranty. I mentioned to the service writer that the tech will likely notice the t-bar clamp I used and explained why I did it. This time I leave THIS thread printed out on the passenger seat and mention, "Hey maybe it's the intake gaskets (hint hint!) Later the dealer calls me back to tell me they think it's front A/F sensor and NOT my t-bar clamp connected hose. They quote over $400 to replace the A/F sensor.

I decline their offer and find the part at Fred Beans Suburu (in PA.) and find out they charge around $130 for the part. My local dealer wants over $200.00. I let the local dealer attempt a price match and they quote me about $10.00 more than the Fred Beans Subaru would charge. I figure, what the heck, I'll support the local guys and avoid the shipping delays. I install the part myself and clear the CEL. The weather gets crazy warm for winter and the car runs just fine.

 

4. A few days ago the weather goes back to winter-like and the CEL and crappy idle comes back. Now I'm pissed, but I'm rather civil when I tell the dealer that I am CONVINCED that the intake gaskets are the issue. The dealer comes back with yep, you're probably right and then proceed to tell me to replace anything under warranty, they will have to replace the IC intake elbow back to stock first to see if a CEL shows up!

Do I still have the stock end "boots" for it. I do so I bring them back. They call me last night to tell me that they put a new one on and want me to pay for it. Then I will need to take the car back to see if the freaking CEL comes back on before they will do anything else on the car!

I melt down on the poor service writer (he's a cool car enthusiast guy) and mention that my wife and I have bought 4 stick shifted Subarus from them since I got my original 02 WRX back in 2001. I even went so far as to wear my Subie Rally shoes, hat, and t-shirt to the dealer when I brought the rubber IC hose boots back to prove I wasn't some dildo trying to get free parts, but probably the biggest Subaru whore their dealer has ever seen. I was told I would be called back today after the service writer talks with the Svc Manager again... Sorry to vent, to you guys, but getting my dealer to fix this glitch has been insane.

Edited February 15, 2012 by paycer

[Max Capacity]

FYI I have replaced both my 02's sensors on the 05 wagon. I found that Car Quest Auto Parts sells them for $80.00. Simple to install. That's for a direct fit sensor, not a cheap universal fit one.

[spec.B Dream]

Paycer, you in or near Omaha? I can help you replace the IMGs, they're like a total of $10. Also, if you need to go back for warranty work, try another dealer. There's a thread on nebraska-subaru.com with several huge rants about a certain local dealer's service department.

 

Again assuming you're in/near Omaha, once you're out of warranty, Russ Garage is the best place to go for any Subaru issues.

[paycer]

Max Capacity: I almost went that route but I was pretty sure my A/F sensor was just fine and I wanted use the factory OEM Denso part to avoid the dealer blaming it on a "bunk" (READ: perfectly acceptable substitute) part.

 

spec.B Dream, yes I am in Omaha. I just looked at the thread on nebraska-subaru that I think you're talking about is not the one I'm having issues with. The one that sorta rhymes with Spam Wholesome is the one causing me grief now. I've used them for warranty work on the past three other turbo Subies and had zero problems with them, but most of the staff has turned over in the svc dept so I'm dealing with fresh faces now.

 

The svc writer (cool guy actually trying to help me) is supposed to call me back today after he tries to reason with the svc manager. If that is still a bust, I'll have a 'sit down' with the svc manager tomorrow before I fire up a call to SOA to officially complain. I've always done all my out of warranty Subie work myself, but have heard that Russ' Garage is excellent and I'll use him if I get something that's over my head. Hopefully, I get some satisfaction from the dealer but if not, I'll report back in much shorter post!

 

P.S. thanks for the offer to help with the IMGs, they sound like a pain to get at on the driver's side and I may just take you up on your offer if the dealer continues to play dumb and uncooperative.

[spec.B Dream]

Sounds good. I hope all works out. Let me know if you end up needing assistance. Be sure to say hello if you can make it to one of the Tuesday J-Birds meets.