New BW EFR turbos coming soon through FR!!!!

[ClimberDHexMods]

A lot of info here now:

 

I don't see the comp maps up yet for the EFR turbos, but the usefulness of their tools is very high!!!!

 

http://borgwarnerboosted.com/

 

Ugh the tool that calculates your compressor and turbine map plots is a bit confusing with the up and down Turbine Expansion Ratio values.

 

How do you use that tool properly?

 

Aside from having to learn a few new things, this looks pretty fun and straight-forward to use.

 

That 70S75 looks rather tasty... anything bigger starts to be no good down low (if that matters to you).

 

76S75 hits surge line...

 

67/80 looks like a much better 20G

[rockle3]

any word on pricing?

[ClimberDHexMods]

For my own sanity:

 

62K80 = 44lb

67X80 = 49lb

70S75 = 56lb

76S75 = 64lb

83S75 = 79lb

91S74 = 95lb

 

Please note these lb/min ratings from BW are at the absolute max limit, and are not practical unless you want to fill a hot air balloon.

[ClimberDHexMods]

I fail to see how a 35R sized unit, such as the 76S75 could spool like a VF39... the map's efficiency islands just don't go that far left, nor does the surge line... anybody?

[LittleBlueGT]

I fail to see how a 35R sized unit, such as the 76S75 could spool like a VF39... the map's efficiency islands just don't go that far left, nor does the surge line... anybody?

 

 

Like I said before, not spool in 4th gear like a VF39, but spool in 2nd gear like a VF39.

[NSFW]

I fail to see how a 35R sized unit, such as the 76S75 could spool like a VF39... the map's efficiency islands just don't go that far left, nor does the surge line... anybody?

 

I think you're making the wrong comparison...

The 76S75 has a 76mm compressor exducer, and so does a GT3076R.

BW's power suitability chart suggests 375-600chp for the 76S75.

Garrett calls their 3076 a 520chp turbo, and Subarus tend to make just under 400whp with it.

 

So, I think the "35R sized" BW would be the 83S75.

 

The compressor map plotter thing on the BW site doesn't look very promising, but I suspect that's just because I'm used to how things plot on Garrett's maps. I'll reserve judgment until dyno charts start showing up.

[integroid]

The compressor maps are available on the spec sheets?

 

http://www.turbodriven.com/files/pdf/179357-EFRTechPages.pdf

[ClimberDHexMods]

LBGT and NSFW, thank you for clearing up both points

 

I too am having problems working with the selector tool, but I would not be surprised if that is my own fault. Changing most things throws the plot right out the window.

[ClimberDHexMods]

EFR7064

http://lh3.ggpht.com/_u9ivxKMxaQw/TNGbGNEdUZI/AAAAAAAADaY/SAxwTPNHYgU/s720/Fullscreen%20capture%201132010%20122102%20PM.bmp.jpg

 

 

EFR7670

http://lh6.ggpht.com/_u9ivxKMxaQw/TNGbG7j90iI/AAAAAAAADac/1bti7uPsy0Q/s720/Fullscreen%20capture%201132010%20122136%20PM.bmp.jpg

 

 

EFR8374

http://lh6.ggpht.com/_u9ivxKMxaQw/TNGbHlzaioI/AAAAAAAADag/K8jjzcFxuX8/s720/Fullscreen%20capture%201132010%20122224%20PM.bmp.jpg

 

 

 

Probably best to ignore the plots on the map, but know that those are the unrefined defaults for a 2.5L engine growing to 17psi...

[ClimberDHexMods]

Vs a shining example of the SX line

http://lh5.ggpht.com/_u9ivxKMxaQw/TNH3HkpVBJI/AAAAAAAADa8/6kBTIGdYxmo/s512/BorgWarner%20S200SX%20Specs.JPG

 

S200SX vs EFR7670 (76S75)

Sorry I don't know how to use photoshop, so use mind photoshop

http://lh3.ggpht.com/_u9ivxKMxaQw/TNH7K5WCovI/AAAAAAAADbM/9C8JWmlw0Eg/s640/S200SX%20vs%20EFR%2076S75.jpg

 

Apparently there was next to no advancement to the compressor wheel. But a significantly improved set of everything else would make this a real ass-kicker.

 

A twinscroll 7670 would be disgusting on the street...

 

Really on the fence between the 7670 and 8374.

 

As I understand it, we have almost a S200SX 75 series and S300SX 83 series, with upgraded everything else besides the actual compressors... in for logs and dyno plots!

[JoeFromPA]

In my mind, the "turbo of the future" will no longer be snail shaped.

 

A vf46 or bigger turbo is a huge piece of hardware under the engine (especially including the associated hardware) that is in an inflexible shape. Between the physical shape, the need to keep stuff away from the heat, and the need to be able to access it....well, their placement usually sucks.

 

In my mind, a "turbo of the future" be will a rigid or semi-rigid tube (with a dimpled interior, where the dimples smooth air flow and allow for some tube movement). The tube will comprise both wheels and will allow for air flows to be seperated. And it could be placed optimally - the compressor wheel could be significantly further away from the turbine, allowing for less heating of the intake charge and a reduced intake pathway length.

 

etc.

 

I think the basic shape itself needs to be revised in the "turbo of the future"...

 

Otherwise, it's just a better "turbo of today"

 

[executor485]

In my mind, the "turbo of the future" will no longer be snail shaped.

 

A vf46 or bigger turbo is a huge piece of hardware under the engine (especially including the associated hardware) that is in an inflexible shape. Between the physical shape, the need to keep stuff away from the heat, and the need to be able to access it....well, their placement usually sucks.

 

In my mind, a "turbo of the future" be will a rigid or semi-rigid tube (with a dimpled interior, where the dimples smooth air flow and allow for some tube movement). The tube will comprise both wheels and will allow for air flows to be seperated. And it could be placed optimally - the compressor wheel could be significantly further away from the turbine, allowing for less heating of the intake charge and a reduced intake pathway length.

 

etc.

 

I think the basic shape itself needs to be revised in the "turbo of the future"...

 

Otherwise, it's just a better "turbo of today"

 

 

I'm with you on the thoughts that the "future of turbo's" is something quite different than what we have today. I also have a few thoughts on it, but I'll keep those just in case I can make something of it lol

There were a lot of enhancements done to this turbo for sure, things that will make turbo's more efficient and possibly more cost effective in some applications, but it does not seem that just purely design wise, this is something earth shattering. I'm def gonna wait for dyno's to cast final judgement, but what I see is a turbo that uses the best efficiency parts from all the turbo's available now, and integrates a few things you already need to have (EBCS, BOV, WG). So, good advances, but I cant help feeling that turbo's have a LONG way to go before "redefining what we think and know about turbo's".

[praedet]

An axial compressor and turbine set-up would do what you propose, but they are REALLY expensive and have there own disadvantages...

[ClimberDHexMods]

I think we need road data from the EFR series...

[sumfoo1]

See .65 turbine is tiny. Please don't ever act like you know more about turbo machinery than me again next time.

 

Thanks ,

Foo1 (an industrial compressor/turbine engineer)

[LuckyBob]

See .65 turbine is tiny. Please don't ever act like you know more about turbo machinery than me again next time.

 

Thanks ,

Foo1 (an industrial compressor/turbine engineer)

 

Good to know your ePenis is bigger than everybody else's. Well played.

[NSFW]

 

Where did that come from?

[rockle3]

tourettes?

[ClimberDHexMods]

Guys guys you probably haven't heard, I'm kind of a big deal.

[mwiener2]

Any idea where I can find a 3076HTA single-scroll dyno chart for comparison?

 

It's not an HTA, but it is a 3076 with a .86 A/R and a HFC

 

http://i974.photobucket.com/albums/ae227/5250Performance/FMTDyno.jpg

 

 

 

I'm gonna slap an EFR on there when I see how they do in subie land.

[ClimberDHexMods]

The 7670 is only $2300... Next step up is high 20s

 

I can buy a brand new S200SX 75-70 on eBay for $550.

 

I guess that's how it goes.

[sumfoo1]

Sometime when the release the turbine specs for the stock. Location I said .65a/r that's pretty small and I was told it a ratio like as the turbo gets bigger so does the turbine. Regardless .65 area/ radius is going to choke quickly. I apologize for that comment it just bothers me when someone assumes you are dumb because they have 100x more posts on here. I am well aware that it is the ratio of the area of the volute to the radius of the volute from the turbo center as the volute progresses around the turbine wheel. Still doesn't mean it's going to work well when the turbine is larger. It is still inefficient no matter how large it is. ( it may not choke but the wheel will be so heavy you still lose spool. ) anyway sorry for being a dick just don't like to be called dumb but I guess My s/n lends itself to it.

[LuckyBob]

That and your writing skills.

[sumfoo1]

Cell phone poster. Sorry

[rockle3]

updated with prices

http://www.full-race.com/articles/borgwarner-efr-turbos.html