BAC5.2 Posted October 27, 2010 Share Posted October 27, 2010 If they are equal to them then why all of the fuss? I am sure Subaru knows nothing about the oil filtration needs of the engines that it builds, so the search for a better oil filter continues - increased bearing wear be damned! I agree that Subaru knows what it needs. That's why the TR RX8 filters are so appealing. Essentially identical to the OE filter, but with increased volume capacity. [URL="http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/proper-flip-key-interesti-159894.html"]Flip Key Development Thread[/URL] "Genius may have its limitations, but stupidity is not thus handicapped." - E. Hubbard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishbone Posted October 27, 2010 Share Posted October 27, 2010 Your UOA of the P1 showed "abnormal bearing wear". Why? "classic Subie fuel dillution driven bearing wear". Rod ends and mains? This was the lead reading. Once it was 22, then 12, then 18, then 45 I will have another winter UOA going in, again on the same oil and same filter. It is sitting on the shelf waiting to be sent in. ALL these were on the same oil and filter except the 22 reading, which was Mobil 1 and OEM filter. All the other wear levels were lower on P1 with both M1 and Pennzoil, but more importantly the contaminants measured were much lower. Silica went from 19 to 5, sodium from 13 to 7 over time, etc. Without getting into it too deep, my Dyson UOAs looked better and I was told both the oil and filter were doing great. When I pulled the banjo bolts they were whistle clean at 50+K miles IIRC. Unfortunately I did not have the foresight to pull the screen filters out altogether so the new bolts that went in still have them in. It is something I plan on doing whenever I get around to it. So, to sum it up, I see zero reason right now to switch back to OEM oil filters especially when the P1 can be had in the taller size AND it supposebly did a better job at keeping the oil clean. In my experience, for my driving habits, 14-18 relief valve is fine. The Purolator filters have the valve made of metal, if that means anything to anyone because I know some cry bloody murder when they hear of cardboard ends, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GTTuner Posted October 27, 2010 Share Posted October 27, 2010 ^^^^ Like rao states; "Driving your car is bad for it". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nosser25rs Posted October 27, 2010 Share Posted October 27, 2010 Sure, it lowers the risk of reduced oil flow, but increases the risk associated with unfiltered oil. I dunno what to think, really- why did Subaru specify a bypass pressure that was significantly higher than normal? And those filters... tiny! Regarding the why, see post 5 in this thread: http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1430991&page=1 Made good sense to me and informed my decision to go with the Mazda filter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GTTuner Posted October 27, 2010 Share Posted October 27, 2010 Ever see what these motors make for oil pressure? It's around 100psi at 2500 rpm. Remember the valve opens from pressure differental inside the filter, not overall oil pressure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishbone Posted October 27, 2010 Share Posted October 27, 2010 ^^^^ Like rao states; "Driving your car is bad for it". I stopped worrying about UOAs a long time ago. Now I do it just because I'm curious and have the money for an occasional one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishbone Posted October 27, 2010 Share Posted October 27, 2010 Ever see what these motors make for oil pressure? It's around 100psi at 2500 rpm. Remember the valve opens from pressure differental inside the filter, not overall oil pressure. And pressure differential is also dictated by the flow restriction the filter itself poses, which is affected by the type of material used, density, size (length) etc. Purolator ain't that restrictive, we don't know how the OEM filter rates, and it's not like we live and drive in the sandstorms of Sahara. Somehow the OEM filter, even with it's higher relief valve setting, didn't do as good as the Purolator. Go figure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
utc_pyro Posted November 12, 2010 Share Posted November 12, 2010 I just ordered four of these filters to try out. I've been getting a strange whining/clattering sound out of the right side of my motor on cold starts. I think it might be the race oil filter I have going into bypass. Any one other then Nosser25rs try one of these yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BAC5.2 Posted November 12, 2010 Share Posted November 12, 2010 I'm going to order a case of these as well. They are only marginally more expensive than the ones I use now. [URL="http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/proper-flip-key-interesti-159894.html"]Flip Key Development Thread[/URL] "Genius may have its limitations, but stupidity is not thus handicapped." - E. Hubbard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackfortune Posted November 12, 2010 Share Posted November 12, 2010 I installed one yesterday with Mobil1 0W40.....motor has 152k with original VF40......prior OCI's of 3750m with Mobil1 5W30......be interesting to see if the motor gets noisey on the 0W40....nothing observable on or after first runs.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddoc Posted November 16, 2010 Share Posted November 16, 2010 N3R1-14-302 is for 09+ RX8 B6Y1-14-302 is the correct filter for your 04 B6Y1 is a shorter filter,used in RX7's / RX8's up to 08 / Protege / Miata up to 05 / Mazda 2 Everyone is screaming for the PN N3R1-14-302, but after reading this comment shouldn't then B6Y1-14-302 be the EXACT same filter as the old black Subaru Tokyo Roki filter? I did some quick research for other oil filter manufacturers: The '05 RX8 and '05 LGT use the same exact filters from K&N (HP-1008), WIX (51365), and Purolator (PureOne) (PL14612)...and actually, my Miata uses the same filter too ! SO... wouldn't you guys want B6Y1-14-302 ? Or is the relief valve too low? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BAC5.2 Posted November 16, 2010 Share Posted November 16, 2010 But the B6 has a relief pressure to low for the LGT. The N3 has the same relief pressure. [URL="http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/proper-flip-key-interesti-159894.html"]Flip Key Development Thread[/URL] "Genius may have its limitations, but stupidity is not thus handicapped." - E. Hubbard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddoc Posted November 16, 2010 Share Posted November 16, 2010 But the B6 has a relief pressure to low for the LGT. The N3 has the same relief pressure. Why would every manufacturer for Aftermarket oil filters use the same one for the LGT and 04-8 RX8, etc if it would cause an issue though? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishbone Posted November 16, 2010 Share Posted November 16, 2010 More importantly, why would aftermarket manufacturers use a bypass setting lower than 20-23 or whatever is used by OEM? I went with a PL14610 which is longer than the PL14612 and called it a day. The bypass is 14-18PSI. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBT Posted November 16, 2010 Share Posted November 16, 2010 I'd have clearance issues with the longer Mazda TR filter over the Subaru AA100 (black TR filter) since the STI Oil sender "sandwich" orients the stubby AA100 filter down at least as far as the new "blue" Subaru filter replacements. Not sure I'd care to have it hanging out there any further, even it it was an equal replacement for the AA100 version. That said, I bought 25 of the AA100s when Fred Bean still had them and it will be a while before I get through all of the current stock (at ~6 a year, I've got at least another 3 years to go)... - Pro amore Dei et patriam et populum - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
utc_pyro Posted November 16, 2010 Share Posted November 16, 2010 I got my four filters in last night, and I've got to say these are quality construction. Better than anything I've held past the OEM transmission filter or the $20/ea race filters I'm using right now. I may buy a case of these things if the oil analysis comes back good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gmachine Posted November 16, 2010 Share Posted November 16, 2010 Why would every manufacturer for Aftermarket oil filters use the same one for the LGT and 04-8 RX8, etc if it would cause an issue though? The main reason IMO would be cost. If you can make one part that fits more applications you stand to profit more. The lower psi rating on the filter is not going to result in engine failure in the short term. It may be fine for 20 40 80k we just don't know,but will it be as healthy at those same intervals if the correct filter was used. Subaru and Mazda specs a certain psi for their valve,I trust the guys who designed the engines to know what it should use. I've said it before,OEM filters are relatively cheap. Just use the correct oem filter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddoc Posted November 17, 2010 Share Posted November 17, 2010 Subaru and Mazda specs a certain psi for their valve,I trust the guys who designed the engines to know what it should use. I've said it before,OEM filters are relatively cheap. Just use the correct oem filter. No, I agree with that one, I'm just trying to figure out why we couldn't use the shorter B6Y1-14-302 filter. Is the valve spec'd to a lower PSI? How can we find out? It'd be nice to be able to use the same filter on my Miata and LGT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gmachine Posted November 17, 2010 Share Posted November 17, 2010 The RX8 spec sheet in post #5 list the bypass spec for both filters. 2008 and prior is 11.4 - 17.1 psi 2009 + is 20.3 - 26.1 psi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBT Posted November 17, 2010 Share Posted November 17, 2010 Realize that rotary engines don't have valve systems in the way that our's do, but I wonder if Mazda, on the 2009+ models, went with some type of hydraulic engine control solenoid(s) system similar to what Subaru did with the AVCS, hence the increase in dynamic line pressures? - Pro amore Dei et patriam et populum - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddoc Posted November 17, 2010 Share Posted November 17, 2010 The RX8 spec sheet in post #5 list the bypass spec for both filters. 2008 and prior is 11.4 - 17.1 psi 2009 + is 20.3 - 26.1 psi D'oh. I thought that was just refering to the '09 RX8s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BAC5.2 Posted November 17, 2010 Share Posted November 17, 2010 Realize that rotary engines don't have valve systems in the way that our's do, but I wonder if Mazda, on the 2009+ models, went with some type of hydraulic engine control solenoid(s) system similar to what Subaru did with the AVCS, hence the increase in dynamic line pressures? I think you are confusing line pressure with bypass pressure. Overall oil system pressure is independent of the filter bypass pressure. Rotaries require oil to lubricate the apex seals. I believe the RX7 motors would actually inject oil to keep the rotor walls lubricated. [URL="http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/proper-flip-key-interesti-159894.html"]Flip Key Development Thread[/URL] "Genius may have its limitations, but stupidity is not thus handicapped." - E. Hubbard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBT Posted November 17, 2010 Share Posted November 17, 2010 ^ Could be... - Pro amore Dei et patriam et populum - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rao Posted November 17, 2010 Share Posted November 17, 2010 This thread is hilarious and it keeps getting better. Rob IF YOU CARE ABOUT YOUR CAR YOU SHOULD NEVER DRIVE IT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishbone Posted November 17, 2010 Share Posted November 17, 2010 Sir, motor oil and filtration is no laughing matter. It is the lifeblood of the engine! If you took this serious, you wouldn't have to open threads about changing out the banjo bolt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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