non-US Outback vs USDM vs Bilstein BTS5056J

[Impatient]

The question in here is to anyone out there with a non-USDM 05-09 (Gen III) Outback: do you consider your Outback’s ride & handling “controlled, crisp and tight?” Is all the complaining from US owners? Or do Euro, Australian, N. Zealand, or Asia-spec owners also yearn for the Bilstein kit?

These forums are all over the Bilstein kit out of Japan. See http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/bilstein-bts-kit-group-buy-131692.html and http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/bilstein-japan-bts-suspension-kit-install-parts-list-114243.html?t=114243. If I had a gazillion dollars and still wanted an Outback, I would buy the BTS kit. But in the real world, I am looking for a cheaper, yet reliable alternative. I am pursuing getting KYB information for a Euro-spec Outback. In Europe, KYB has a 341354 rear shock (vs USDM 341442), and 334374 & 334375 for the Euro front shocks. I am asking KYB if they can comment on relative damping of those vs USDM stock or US GR2’s. And perhaps they sell matching springs under their K-Flex brand (or otherwise). Initial efforts pointed to different sizing, but this may be consistent with the ride-height difference going to the BTS, which MIGHT be the same height as most non-US Outbacks. I’ll report back with any useful info I come up with.

In the meantime, I’m trying to also gauge whether just going from a stock USDM Outback suspension to a Euro, Japan, or Australian spec Outback would, in and of itself, be a huge improvement. That assumes there is a non-self-leveling non-USDM version. If it turns out the euro-KYB option is a slight upgrade over that, the combined effect might be significant enough for a US owner to spend money on. My hope is that this approach plus a rear swaybar, and maybe some bushings would still be $600+ cheaper than just the BTS kit itself (which requires additional parts anyway).

[pachilla]

I have 2007 Euro-Spec Outback 3.0R and the handling is very controlled for such a big and tall vehicle.

 

I have 225/45/19 RE050As, these are WAY better than stock junk rubber, get some nice rubber first!!.

 

My Outback has JDM top hats and rear self-leveling KYB struts, VDC and the SI-Drive (beware that the rear self-leveling suspension uses different diameter spring and top-hat, don't ask how I knew......

 

Euro Outback has aluminum hood, hatch (but not the aluminum suspension of the JDM version.

 

USDM Outback has softer suspension and "more ride height" than the rest of the world Outback.

 

Even the tires are taller (225/55/17 vs 215/55/17)

 

My friend also has Euro-Spec Outback 3.0R and he now riding on BC BR Outback-Specific Coil-Overs and I drove his car a little. It felt very compliant and street friendly, so I will be getting a set of BC BR myself in the future.

 

http://img22.imageshack.us/img22/3903/80622633.jpg

[Impatient]

this is ongoing thread at subaruoutback.org...."replacing rear shocks on 05 XT"

Rear:

Euro GR2 50-60% stiffer than stock

US GR2 15% stiffer than stocl

US 00-04 GR2 approx = stock (05-09)

some sizing differences: Euro a bit shorter with higher spring perch

Front:

Euro GR2 allegedly 70% stiffer than US GR2...wow.

[Impatient]

I'm envious. Again, I have no idea what all gets changed to do self-leveling, but per KYB, their aftermarket GR2-s for the Euro are way stiffer than USDM. Just in case you are interested, the rear Euro part #'s are 341354, and the fronts are 334374 & 5. This is for NON-self leveling though.

[xt2005bonbon]

reviving old thread. I have my USDM in Europa land right now and my rear suspension is having some issues (see here). time to change that suv feel .

Could any of you be so kind to help me finish the 'shopping list' in order to change all of my 4 shocks with KYB EDM equipment?

 

So far from what Impatient is saying, I'd need

FRONT:

STRUT LEFT P/N--> 334374

STRUT RIGHT P/N--> 334375

REAR:

STRUT LEFT P/N--> 341354

STRUT RIGHT P/N--> 341354

 

Anything else?

like perch, top hat, coils, etc... Can I reuse some of my old stuff?

 

Pachilla, did you finally get the BC BR?

[xt2005bonbon]

update to list. just found p/n for kyb rear springs..

 

So far from what Impatient is saying, I'd need

FRONT:

STRUT LEFT P/N--> 334374

STRUT RIGHT P/N--> 334375

REAR:

STRUT LEFT P/N--> 341354

STRUT RIGHT P/N--> 341354

SPRINGS L/R P/N---> RA6264

[Impatient]

Few points:

 

1) My 2nd post needs a correction: KYB rear shocks for 00-04 are definitely stiffer than KYB for 05-09. Higher compression damping and IMHO less rebound damping...allowing for a fast return. ASSUMING the other info I got from KYB tech was accurate, I would be concerned with getting something stiffer than the 00-04 KYB's. Unless Tech meant Euro model had more rebound damping and I just misinterpretted that to be "stiffer."

2) It seems like such a shame to get KYB's so near the "source" of Bilsteins and Koni's....but I know they disclaim their products to be for "non-Outback." Still it can be done if you have some patience and some money, and don't mind a lower car. And I don't mean BTS money, although maybe 1/3 to 1/2 that. Plenty of people on this website who have made the conversion. Look good, handle better, but less "Moab-able."

3) Another approach If you have patience and a USA connection is to order the rear KYB's for the 00-04 (part #341276) here in the USA, or FROM here in the USA along with stock rear springs, and get them shipped. Lots of people like them (more than I do) and there is much less need to mess with the fronts, unless you are sure they are going bad too. But this is a naive suggestion, i don't know squat about shipping. You could even get KYB's for the 05-09 this way, for minimal improvement over stock.

4) if there is such a thing as a Subaru dealer there, inquire about STOCK rear shocks & springs for ANY 04-08 EURO Outback WITHOUT Self-Leveling...I think there was such a thing. This will probably be more expensive than KYB and if it lowers the ride, will probably necessitate getting matching front shocks/springs.

5) good luck. I would fix the back, worry about the front later.

[xt2005bonbon]

Few points:

 

2) It seems like such a shame to get KYB's so near the "source" of Bilsteins and Koni's....but I know they disclaim their products to be for "non-Outback." Still it can be done if you have some patience and some money, and don't mind a lower car. And I don't mean BTS money, although maybe 1/3 to 1/2 that. Plenty of people on this website who have made the conversion. Look good, handle better, but less "Moab-able."

 

^That's the thing. I want my car to stop bouncing like a Tahoe but I still want it to be "Moab-able" since I like going offroad from time to time. So I want to keep my ground clearance.

 

3) Another approach If you have patience and a USA connection is to order the rear KYB's for the 00-04 (part #341276) here in the USA, or FROM here in the USA along with stock rear springs, and get them shipped. Lots of people like them (more than I do) and there is much less need to mess with the fronts, unless you are sure they are going bad too. But this is a naive suggestion, i don't know squat about shipping. You could even get KYB's for the 05-09 this way, for minimal improvement over stock.

 

^I will go that route if I can't find a fairly simple EDM replacement kit. My front shocks are still fine btw.

 

4) if there is such a thing as a Subaru dealer there, inquire about STOCK rear shocks & springs for ANY 04-08 EURO Outback WITHOUT Self-Leveling...I think there was such a thing. This will probably be more expensive than KYB and if it lowers the ride, will probably necessitate getting matching front shocks/springs.

5) good luck. I would fix the back, worry about the front later.

 

^they do have subaru dealers over here but very few..Rare breed in France unless you live close to the Alps.

 

In any case, my goal is to first fix the rear. I would like to find out if I can install the euro KYB in the back. But I am worried about having the rear lower than spec afterwards as EDM outbacks are a bit lower than USDM...