sic GT Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 I replaced the battery in my legacy today and had to reflash the realtime map from my AP version 2. The reflash seemed to go normally but when I drove the car the 5EAT started and still is shifting real harsh on the 1-2 upshift and 4-3 downshift as well. The issue is most pronounce in Sport mode but noticeable in all modes. I then discconnected the battery cable reflashed again (reatime) and same thing in regular, sport or manual. I then umarried the Accessport and did the green connector re-mary flash per the Accessport instructions disconnected the green connectors and then reflashed the realtime again. Same issue. Even pulled the ECU fuse #12 behind the dash per the Subaru manual and the reflashed the realtime again. Still no change. Has any body experienced this type of erractic transmission behavior after a battery change and reflash? If so any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim1969 Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 I had a similar issue after my tranny was replaced. I was also running the AP and vf52 setup. Could not get the issue to resolve. I ended up going back to stock and the shift shock issue went away. I'm stock now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sic GT Posted December 10, 2009 Author Share Posted December 10, 2009 At dealer now. They believe the adaptive logic control is out of whack and are resetting the parameters. $99.00 just to look at the car. This applied to the cost of repairing. Also will probably do a trans flush to which Subaru is asking $149.99 for providing the logic recalibration bill isn't too steep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIPjeep2002 Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 keep us posted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sic GT Posted December 10, 2009 Author Share Posted December 10, 2009 Update. Dealer has reprogrammed the adaptive logic control several times this morning. Service advisor says that each time the tech reloads the parameters, takes the car out for a test loop and jumps on the gas a little the tcm loses it's ability to store/ retain the info based on the drivers habits. Essentially the tcm is constantly learning from 0 but not retaining the learned info thus resulting in the really jolting shift behavior. I left the car with the dealer and they are dealing directly with Subaru to determine the next move. This is not confidence inspiring but it would seem the TCM or at least certian areas of it's software retention capabilities is/are shot. That is my amateur opinion so far. I really don't understand how changing a battery and reflashing would affect the TCM since the general consensus of this forum and two well respected tuners ( well maybe 1.5 tuners on second thought!!) is that manipulating/ retuning the car in no way ever touches or affects the TCM. Or does it??? Hmmmm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim1969 Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 My tuner felt it was a logic issue. I went from EcuTeK to the AP and still had it. Only went away when I went back to stock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sic GT Posted December 10, 2009 Author Share Posted December 10, 2009 Seems like the dealer is at a loss for what's going on and is now for the most part under the advisement from the Subaru Tech Dept at corporate as it was explained to me by my service advisor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RabidWombat Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 Voltage spike when reconnecting the battery damaged the TCU? That's the best I could come up with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishbone Posted December 14, 2009 Share Posted December 14, 2009 You guys should know that flashing the ECU does nothing to the TCU, which is a completely separate entity and it is not flashable/controlable except with a Subaru Select Monitor software/tool. If the tranny acts up, don't waste time with reflashing the ECU, disconnecting the battery, unmarrying APs, etc. as these will not do anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sic GT Posted December 14, 2009 Author Share Posted December 14, 2009 I am now on day 5 without the car. Subaru dealer continues to tell me they are still trying to identify why the tcm is blowing off any of the calibrations/ parameters the techs are programing it with when they drive the car in a more spirited fashion. The tcm seems to be able to retain the programed info under light throttle driving but not when the car is pushed. As of this morning the techs were tracing related wiring to the tcm to see if any connections were failed. I am supposed to recieve an update tonight before the service dept. closes at 8pm. I would have thought the problem should have been identified by now after so many days in Subarus hands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim1969 Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 good luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snow05gtRI Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 check your car out when you get it back. it sounds like their testing is taking it out for a joy ride (spirited driving). i know this is involved in your problem, but they've had it for days trying to get the TCU to program by driving hard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sic GT Posted December 15, 2009 Author Share Posted December 15, 2009 I am usually very careful not to jump on my car when it's cold, don't accelerate hard out of a corner, never brake/torque launched or autox and fairly diligent on transmission fluid changes. My current setup is VF-52, 740 inj, Perrin TMIC and requisite UP and Perrin double catted DP. I am not really sure what stage this is anymore-stage 2+?? Hopefully the tech isn't jacking my car up by jumping on it really hard from a standstill to resolve the shifting issue & that I still have decent clutch packs that aren't toast when I do finally get it back. Begining to think that other than checking/ reprogramming shift parameters with the Subaru Select monitor, the techs really do not have a lot of experience working on the 5EAT on a more indepth/ invasive manner after 5 days and no concrete answer as to what is wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kshymkiw Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 I have something similar, my 5EAT this afternoon mis-shifted itself, without me getting into it or anything. It just wound out a gear in normal mode, then didn't make the shift so I let off of it. Now I have a weird "double shift" when I first take off. Kind of seems like the logic is all out of whack, as in my car thinks it is in a different gear than it actually is. I need to take it in and see what is going on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sic GT Posted December 16, 2009 Author Share Posted December 16, 2009 Car was returned to me last night with instructions from the Subaru tech that I may need to drive the car up to 8 hours to allow the adaptive logic to relearn and adjust for a smooth shift. I had the service advisor document that there was not damage to the mechanical "hard parts" in the transmission and that the fluid was very clean with no evidence of metal shavings etc. contained within the fluid itself. According to my adviser all wiring and electrical connections passed the test. I mentioned "why not swap the tcm, program it and see if it resolves the issue?". To this the advisor told me there are 4 different modules within the 5EAT thus eluding to having to swap all of those modules is time consuming and expensive. So basically we left the repair order open and I am supposed to drive the car for a week, if the hard, skip or double shifting( as described by the above poster) that I am experiencing disappears then great, if not then back to the dealer for an additional round of trial and error. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kshymkiw Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 Car was returned to me last night with instructions from the Subaru tech that I may need to drive the car up to 8 hours to allow the adaptive logic to relearn and adjust for a smooth shift. I had the service advisor document that there was not damage to the mechanical "hard parts" in the transmission and that the fluid was very clean with no evidence of metal shavings etc. contained within the fluid itself. According to my advisor all wiring and electrical connections passed the test. I mentioned "why not swap the tcm, program it and see if it resolves the issue". To this the advisor told me there are 4 different modules within the 5EAT thus eluding to having to swap all of those modules is time consuming and expensive. So basically we left the repair order open and I am supposed to drive the car for a week, if the hard, skip or double shifting( as described by the above poster) that I am experiencing dissappears then great, if not then back to the dealer for an additional round of trial and error. Are you getting any slipping under heavy load as well? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sic GT Posted December 16, 2009 Author Share Posted December 16, 2009 It doesn't feel like the transmission is slipping just a jerky hard skip shift when pressed hard and also the 1-2 upshift is really hard under light throttle. Medium throttle smooths out all shifts but heavy throttle makes the shifts rough, skipping and generally out of whack again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kshymkiw Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 It doesn't feel like the transmission is slipping just a jerky hard skip shift when pressed hard and also the 1-2 upshift is really hard under light throttle. Medium throttle smooths out all shifts but heavy throttle makes the shifts rough, skipping and generally out of whack again. I have similar experiences, but I am also getting the slipping feeling in higher loads. I can't really tell if the clutch pack's/VB are toast, or if it is something that can be re-programmed by flashing the TCM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sic GT Posted December 16, 2009 Author Share Posted December 16, 2009 That sounds very similar to a lot of what I am experiencing minus the slipping issue. My problem is the rough erratic gear engagement/ disengagement for the most part. I continue to stand by my belief that Subaru does not or rather is not used to dealing with these types of issues on the 5EAT. Maybe the trans is just generally overstressed by anything over stock levels of power. This subjected has been discussed several times on this site but I wonder if that has anything to do with why that transmission is no longer offered on the 2010 model GT which has essential the same engine with a better turbo and response. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim1969 Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 I agree on your reasoning on the 2010 LGT. I don't think the 5EAT and the turbo setup will work out well long term. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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