*** Knock, do you have any?

[LittleBlueGT]

Are you sure about that? I had the absolute latest revisions (newest beta) back about... September 2009, and it couldn't do it for the 2005 LGT, and probably not the 06 either. But the 07 and up (I think it was 07) it could do it.

 

Ah, I think I spoke too soon. COBB may not have updated those logging parameters for the 05-06 LGT yet (or ever:mad:).

 

Sorry.

[iNVAR]

It has got to be the shitty winter gas in Nebraska. I found a station that sells 95 octane for $4.39 or 100 octane for $6.59. Mixing it with half tank 91 should give me somewhere around 93, the 95 stuff that is. I want to get this for a datalog run and see how the car behaves, to check for "true knock".

NSFW, can I expect the IAM/DAM go back up to 1.0 after a while of driving with no runs above 4k rpm?

I'm going to try a different station too, a Phillips 66 instead of the Shell one by us. I expect it won't make a damn difference but what the heck.

That really depends on where your knock is and how severe it is.

[LittleBlueGT]

Holy scheist, I am back to .88 DAM and DA as low as -0.3. I am hoping it's just a batch of bad gas, the map is the most conservative OTS you can get (COBB ACN 91 Stg2). Do the Cobb maps really disable learning?

 

No, this is the stock COBB table I am talking about:

 

 

http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg194/littlebluegt/FLKCCOBBload.jpg

 

Above 2.2 load FLKC is turned off. FBKC will then be used above that load. So your ECU will still react to knock, but it will never learn anything above that load.

[fishbone]

Above 4500rpms from what I remember. Last night I saw IA gradually dip lower and lower until it hit -0.3. For some reason Excel screwed up the csv so I have no log.

Would running a stock flash on Stage 2 hardware really be a bad idea? I have a catless UP, gutted shorty DP and a TMIC, crank pulley, tranny mount). The rest is bone stock.

Can't I just bump the load in the map from 2.20 and flash the map? What should I set it to and what else should be changed so that the ECU learns throughout?

[KCSunshine]

http://www.legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?t=119079&highlight=stop+sale

 

read this if ure interested... same thing my dealer said, apparently i got one of the faulty 09 2.5L engine w/ weak internals? i dotn know... but hes gonna replace it.

[fishbone]

Mine is an 05. Was that link for me or someone else? Is that a response regarding running the stock tune? Edited December 17, 2009 by fishbone

[KCSunshine]

nope, sorry fish, i was replying to some 1 asking me what happened to my engine. i didnt know how to "quote" reply.

[fishbone]

No matter, because I am still reading that thread. I've seen it before but never got past page 2. It's a good read. I am definitely looking to protect the engine best I can at this point. I do NOT want it to blow and based on how much timing I am pulling, I don't think it is liking the tune one bit.

Come to think of it, it has not liked ANY tune from the point I went Stage 2. I have no idea wtf is going on. Qikslvr is going to help me out with a bro-tune come spring, because right now it is cold and dangerous to be datalogging. So in the meantime I just want to come up with the best solution.

[iNVAR]

Can't I just bump the load in the map from 2.20 and flash the map? What should I set it to and what else should be changed so that the ECU learns throughout?

I don't see why not.... Give it a shot. (Unless someone else jumps in here and says not to.)

[LittleBlueGT]

Can't I just bump the load in the map from 2.20 and flash the map? What should I set it to and what else should be changed so that the ECU learns throughout?

 

Yes, change them both up.

 

I run mine at over 4.0 load. I don't think it really matters, just as long as it encompasses the load range of your engine.

[fishbone]

I will set to 20.0 just to be safe

[LittleBlueGT]

I will set to 20.0 just to be safe

 

 

Just go with 3.90 and 4.00.

[fishbone]

For Fine Learning Load B figures, as shown in the screenshot above?

[LittleBlueGT]

Yes. Here is a screen shot of mine, both on COBB and on RR:

 

http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg194/littlebluegt/FLKCCOBBload-2.jpg

[fishbone]

Gotcha. Can I set the boost to 20 while I am at it?

Ok, enough with the retarded jokes. The ACN acronym in the Cobb maps really should have the N include Nebraska as well ...

[LittleBlueGT]

Gotcha. Can I set the boost to 20 while I am at it?

Ok, enough with the retarded jokes. The ACN acronym in the Cobb maps really should have the N include Nebraska as well ...

 

I wouldn't especially since you are seeing knock right now. If you wanna take on the task of boost control, tuning timing, have a WB, amongst other things, then go for it.

 

FWIW our gas up here is worse then CA gas as well. Many didn't believe me, but a few tuners have found that to be true lately. Either that, or they put regular gas in the premium tanks.

 

A normal Stage2 STI doesn't seem to get over 235 whp up here. That is why I really like alky injection.

[fishbone]

^According to the logs I too, suspect that the damn truckers dump 87 in the 91 tanks.

[LittleBlueGT]

^According to the logs I too, suspect that the damn truckers dump 87 in the 91 tanks.

 

If that is the case then you don't want to run aggressive boost. Sure you can lower timing a ton, and keep it rich, but you will hardly make anymore power (may even make less) and your EGTs will be high, which worries me on long WOT runs.

[fishbone]

It will be interesting to see what comes of our tuning efforts.

I am starting to consider mechanical issues which might trigger knock events, either real or perceived. I had a knock sum of 28 out of boost, low load, this one time. My RomRaider is flaky using the VAG-COM cable and I think it's because I have the AP married still.

Then there is the issue of fuel dillution I have been seeing in my oil analyses reports, consistently over 1.5%, which according to the analysis might be a leaky injector that drips when the car is shut off. No misfires according to RR.

Edited December 17, 2009 by fishbone

[LittleBlueGT]

It will be interesting to see what comes of our tuning efforts.

I am starting to consider mechanical issues which might trigger knock events, either real or perceived. I had a knock sum of 28 out of boost, low load, this one time. My RomRaider is flaky using the VAG-COM cable and I think it's because I have the AP married still.

Then there is the issue of fuel dillution I have been seeing in my oil analyses reports, consistently over 1.5%, which according to the analysis might be a leaky injector that drips when the car is shut off. No misfires according to RR.

 

 

RR works perfectly with AP married ECU.

 

I get waaaay more then 28 counts of knock out of boost just backing out of my driveway. I don't worry about it. Many others have the same thing.

 

If you have a leaky injector, see how the car holds fuel pressure over-night; when the car has been sitting for a long period of time, get in and start-it w/o letting the key sit in the on position for any length of time, just stick the key in and immediately start. If the car starts up right away, then I doubt you have a leaky injector (assuming car has been sitting for 10+ hrs).

[cryo]

Ah, I think I spoke too soon. COBB may not have updated those logging parameters for the 05-06 LGT yet (or ever:mad:).

 

Sorry.

 

you got my hopes up...lol...I have been waiting for that option on the handheld. anyway I got 2 more logs today, one showing a 3rd gear pull and pegged 6.5 da at WOT which is what the table is set at and one with a first and second gear quick WOT and you can see the da pegged on the first gear stab and dropped significatly on the second gear shift and pull. I will be going through and shifting the pipeing as I can hear a IC pipe chattering when I let off the clutch now that I am listening for it...just wanted to get some opinions to make me feel a little safer and that its false knock and not detrimental to the engine. feedback please.

 

mods include catless up,down, K&N typhoon intake, X02 FMIC, vf40, modded stock injectors and running on my protuned 91 oct map at 5k feet.

 

Edit: btw my DAM is at 1.0 and have not reset the ecu since the change back to 91 oct a few weeks ago.

Edited December 18, 2009 by cryo

[fishbone]

If the car starts up right away, then I doubt you have a leaky injector (assuming car has been sitting for 10+ hrs).

The car always starts within the first 4 cranks in the morning after it has sat in the garage for 12 to 14 hours.

 

I really don't get what the hell my car is doing. When I was on the PDX Stage 2 map, I was down to .88 IAM on that one as well. However, IA was set to 8.0 at WOT and it would only go down from 8 to 7.5 at around 4500rpms and then 7.0 up to redline. I am getting the distinct feeling that for some reason this most conservative OTS map that Cobb has to offer in Stage 2 form is actually knocking more than the PDX map. I am now down to .88 IAM on this map as well. I have filled up with 13 gallons of 93 octane (10% ethanol) last night, so I will pull some logs and see WTF the car is doing. Should I just pull the logs with IAM as it is now at .88?

The novice that I am, I still do not fully understand how harmful knock is, in any amount. I am not sure what kind of impact this would have on the motor from a wear and tear standpoint, but according to the oil analyses I have done throughout running all sorts of different revision maps that pretty much all had varrying degrees of knock, my motor is wearing within normal parameters. The only thing that was out of whack last oil analysis I have done over the winter was lead (main bearing wear). But I suspect that the motor will continue to wear within normal parameters all the way up to the day that I blow a piston ...

Edited December 18, 2009 by fishbone

[fishbone]

Here is a thought. How about I fill up with 94 octane or even 100 and see if there is ANY knock at all. I mean I know we are dealing with winter gas and all, but if there still is knock, shouldn't this tell us there is something mechanically wrong, such as a knock sensor acting up or another component making the sensor think there is knock?

[LittleBlueGT]

you got my hopes up...lol...I have been waiting for that option on the handheld. anyway I got 2 more logs today, one showing a 3rd gear pull and pegged 6.5 da at WOT which is what the table is set at and one with a first and second gear quick WOT and you can see the da pegged on the first gear stab and dropped significatly on the second gear shift and pull. I will be going through and shifting the pipeing as I can hear a IC pipe chattering when I let off the clutch now that I am listening for it...just wanted to get some opinions to make me feel a little safer and that its false knock and not detrimental to the engine. feedback please.

 

mods include catless up,down, K&N typhoon intake, X02 FMIC, vf40, modded stock injectors and running on my protuned 91 oct map at 5k feet.

 

Edit: btw my DAM is at 1.0 and have not reset the ecu since the change back to 91 oct a few weeks ago.

 

The log that shows the shift from one gear to the next is indicative of "shift knock", or what I like to call mash knock.

 

Your timing is likely fine in the high load areas (as indicated by your clean 3rd gear run), but in a quick transition from low load to high load (when boost is rising quickly) your timing goes from high to low very quickly, and can result in some knock.

 

I don't think that kind of knock is very dangerous (it never shows up on my knock-light) but it sure can kill power quickly.

 

The solution is to maybe drop some timing in the 1.5 - 2.0 load range at about 4000 rpm.

 

Notice how the timing goes from 35.5, 29.5, then to 15. It is that fast change that causes a bit of knock.

 

The above is all assuming your fueling is good.

[LittleBlueGT]

The car always starts within the first 4 cranks in the morning after it has sat in the garage for 12 to 14 hours.

 

I really don't get what the hell my car is doing. When I was on the PDX Stage 2 map, I was down to .88 IAM on that one as well. However, IA was set to 8.0 at WOT and it would only go down from 8 to 7.5 at around 4500rpms and then 7.0 up to redline. I am getting the distinct feeling that for some reason this most conservative OTS map that Cobb has to offer in Stage 2 form is actually knocking more than the PDX map. I am now down to .88 IAM on this map as well. I have filled up with 13 gallons of 93 octane (10% ethanol) last night, so I will pull some logs and see WTF the car is doing. Should I just pull the logs with IAM as it is now at .88?

The novice that I am, I still do not fully understand how harmful knock is, in any amount. I am not sure what kind of impact this would have on the motor from a wear and tear standpoint, but according to the oil analyses I have done throughout running all sorts of different revision maps that pretty much all had varrying degrees of knock, my motor is wearing within normal parameters. The only thing that was out of whack last oil analysis I have done over the winter was lead (main bearing wear). But I suspect that the motor will continue to wear within normal parameters all the way up to the day that I blow a piston ...

 

 

It is hard to tell w/o seeing logs that include AFR from a WB.

 

The higher octane gas could definitely help a lot. I had to add 3 bottles of octane booster to my car (back in my OTS map days) to get it to show full DA.