silverfool Posted August 3, 2006 Share Posted August 3, 2006 now that there is a reasonable strut replacement with the Tokicos I've been entertaining suspension mods again. how are people making the decisions between the 2 listed choices. from a monetary standpoint, looks like the BC/Megan Racing coilovers can be had for about $900-950. Getting the tokicos and coupling them with any of the popular springs from around here (cheapest being Tein H's and priciest being iONs or pinks) would likely be close to the same ($600 for the struts and 200-300 for the springs). the advantage from a monetary standpoint to the springs I guess would be that you could buy them now, ride out the stock struts for 20-30k more miles and then replace them at that time for a more staged approach. depending on how frequently the coilovers have to be rebuilt and how much trouble/$ that cost, that could be the dealmaker or breaker. However, it would seem to me that for anyone whose stock struts are running outta life that the coilovers seem like a great idea. or is the upkeep for coilovers (including all the clunking I keep reading about) more trouble than its worth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KegTapper Posted August 3, 2006 Share Posted August 3, 2006 It really comes down to adjustability. IMO, installing springs only doesn't properly improve the suspension of a vehicle - spring rates need to be matched with dampening. If the tokicos match well with a variety of aftermarket springs - this is the solution for those of us who just need 1 setting. Coilovers will still be a better choice for those that need the ability to adjust. $0.02 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boostjunkie Posted August 3, 2006 Share Posted August 3, 2006 I think people make too much of rebuilding coilovers. The service life of the dampeners in most coilovers is about the same as that of most standard shocks. At least for the Megan Racing coilovers, when the dampeners start to wear and you need a rebuild, new dampener inserts are available for just $75/ea. That means that instead of spending another $600 for a new set of shocks, you will only spend $300 to renew your coilovers. So really, over the long run, you can actually save money with the MR coilovers. With regard to noises, there are a couple more moving parts on coilovers, but as long as everything is torqued to spec and properly installed there are seldom any problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PGT Posted August 3, 2006 Share Posted August 3, 2006 the adjustability of coilovers is nice, but also a pain. double-edged sword really. every time you make an adjustment, you need to remove them from the car and get a new alignment. That's alot of fiddling around if you want it perfect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boostjunkie Posted August 3, 2006 Share Posted August 3, 2006 the adjustability of coilovers is nice, but also a pain. double-edged sword really. every time you make an adjustment, you need to remove them from the car and get a new alignment. That's alot of fiddling around if you want it perfect. You do NOT need to remove the coilovers from the car to make any adjustments. Height, preload and camber can all be easily adjusted with the coilovers on the car. That's the whole point of them. I recommend driving for a few days after they are installed to make sure of the desired ride height setting, then getting the car aligned. From there it is set and forget, if you so choose. Minor ride height changes do not need another alignment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Th3Franz Posted August 3, 2006 Share Posted August 3, 2006 The majority of coilovers are more noisy and ride harsher due to their performance over comfort design. That's the main reason I went with a strut and spring setup instead. -Franz The end of a Legacy http://www.youtube.com/th3franz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PGT Posted August 3, 2006 Share Posted August 3, 2006 You do NOT need to remove the coilovers from the car to make any adjustments. Height, preload and camber can all be easily adjusted with the coilovers on the car. That's the whole point of them. I recommend driving for a few days after they are installed to make sure of the desired ride height setting, then getting the car aligned. From there it is set and forget, if you so choose. Minor ride height changes do not need another alignment. you are speaking in generalizations. Of the coilovers I've dealt with, most need to be taken off. How else would you shorten the length and thus the ride height on a Cusco Zero2? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boostjunkie Posted August 3, 2006 Share Posted August 3, 2006 you are speaking in generalizations. Of the coilovers I've dealt with, most need to be taken off. How else would you shorten the length and thus the ride height on a Cusco Zero2? I am not speaking in generalizations. Coilovers are adjustable on the car period. In fact, I have adjusted and played with SnoDork's coilovers while they were on the car, and they happen to be Cusco Zero2's. You must have been missing something when you decided you needed to pull them off the car to adjust them. In addition to the Cusco's, I have personally owned 3 other sets of coilovers. Tein Flex, Megan Racing and KW Variant2. All are 100% adjustable on the car. The only thing that needs to be removed to do some things is the wheels. If you have the car on a lift, you can even make most adjustments without removing the wheels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boostjunkie Posted August 3, 2006 Share Posted August 3, 2006 The majority of coilovers are more noisy and ride harsher due to their performance over comfort design. That's the main reason I went with a strut and spring setup instead. KW's FTW! Firmer than stock to be sure, but whisper quiet. Heck even the Megan's are close to stock quiet, although the pillowballs do transmit a touch more impact noise. I think one other MR coilover owner put the increase in noise at 10%. Pretty nominal when you consider the improvement in handling. The KW's are absolutely as quiet as stock since they retain the stock rubber upper mounts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PGT Posted August 3, 2006 Share Posted August 3, 2006 I am not speaking in generalizations. Coilovers are adjustable on the car period. In fact, I have adjusted and played with SnoDork's coilovers while they were on the car, and they happen to be Cusco Zero2's. You must have been missing something when you decided you needed to pull them off the car to adjust them. In addition to the Cusco's, I have personally owned 3 other sets of coilovers. Tein Flex, Megan Racing and KW Variant2. All are 100% adjustable on the car. The only thing that needs to be removed to do some things is the wheels. If you have the car on a lift, you can even make most adjustments without removing the wheels. how do you rotate the lower mounts while bolted up, in order to adjust height then?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boostjunkie Posted August 3, 2006 Share Posted August 3, 2006 You don't turn the lower mount. You loosen the lock ring and twist the upper part. It's a little tough on the Cusco's because they have a rubber bushing up top instead of a pillowball, but it can be done. IIRC, the Teins were the same way and I adjusted those a bunch of times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridgeracer Posted August 4, 2006 Share Posted August 4, 2006 You don't turn the lower mount. You loosen the lock ring and twist the upper part. It's a little tough on the Cusco's because they have a rubber bushing up top instead of a pillowball, but it can be done. IIRC, the Teins were the same way and I adjusted those a bunch of times. +1 Boostjunkie..I change the ride height, preload, and damper settings on my Ksports on car as well. "Gimme mines Balboa...Gimme mines".....Clubber Lang - Mr. T Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
handlebar Posted August 4, 2006 Share Posted August 4, 2006 sorry for Hijacking the thread a bit, but i am in the same boat with the springs/struts vs. coilover dilemma,is there anyone else that drives the rotten roads of P.A. that has suspension mod. insights to offer ? I commute 2 hours a day, but would like better performance(onramps,backroads, future autox possibly) should i spring(ha ha) for the coilovers, or stick with springs, etc.(bars too mabey) hopefully someone can Sway(how shocking more puns) me one way or the other. any PA or NJ "crappy road" suspension setup details would be spiffy, thanks....gotta BOUNCE, er roll Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenonk Posted August 4, 2006 Share Posted August 4, 2006 The majority of coilovers are more noisy and ride harsher due to their performance over comfort design. That's the main reason I went with a strut and spring setup instead. not all are noisy Zeal top hats (on certain models) have harden rubber mated so that the ride is quieter: http://www.speedoptions.com/members/030000_039999/38458/40461//pic20.jpg as well as the P/E bushings: http://www.speedoptions.com/members/030000_039999/38458/40461//pic19.jpg it depends on what you want, there's plenty of choices in a GOOD coilover setup that can do everything that you want to that is suitable for daily driving Keefe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenonk Posted August 4, 2006 Share Posted August 4, 2006 how do you rotate the lower mounts while bolted up, in order to adjust height then?? you can certainly just unlock the ride height locking perch and just spin the upper body as a whole.. it's not that hard.. just time consuming based on the thread count per inch.. Im happy with Zeal @ 10 turns = 1" of travel (or was it 8, I'll have to look up my notes again).. some are rediculous like 16 or finer thread like 20 full turns to travel just 1".. that's a work out. Keefe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenonk Posted August 4, 2006 Share Posted August 4, 2006 sorry for Hijacking the thread a bit, but i am in the same boat with the springs/struts vs. coilover dilemma,is there anyone else that drives the rotten roads of P.A. that has suspension mod. insights to offer ? I commute 2 hours a day, but would like better performance(onramps,backroads, future autox possibly) should i spring(ha ha) for the coilovers, or stick with springs, etc.(bars too mabey) hopefully someone can Sway(how shocking more puns) me one way or the other. any PA or NJ "crappy road" suspension setup details would be spiffy, thanks....gotta BOUNCE, er roll a coilover is really nothing but a fancy set of shocks and springs that are matched properly. a properly set up coilover set can not only out perform a normal shock and spring replacement, but to give you everything that you need to have a compliant ride. the PROBLEM is that not many people take the time to fully understand and maximize the proper setup time of coilovers to make it useful. I drive through PA on my coilovers and I do just fine.. it's really based on your initial setup and then allowing the fine adjustments from there.. I have set up my car to do be able to drive public roads without a problem.. autox and track events are dialed with just camber and rebound adjustments, nothing more.. I also figured out the correct amount of toe I want to run as well between daily driving and track driving so I had to find a minor comprimise there.. so when I dial in my camber, I will know how much I will affect toe. Again, just take your time dialing the coilovers.. they can certainly make it worth your money so long as you take advantage of what they have to offer of just a shock and spring set. Keefe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Th3Franz Posted August 5, 2006 Share Posted August 5, 2006 Yeah Keefe I might get Zeals at somepoint when/if my car goes to the next tier of overall performance consisting of: Coilovers R-compounds Big brake kit Big power, GT30R or something But that won't happen for a long time. I'm happy where this tier 1 level is at. -Franz The end of a Legacy http://www.youtube.com/th3franz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meier motor sports Posted August 5, 2006 Share Posted August 5, 2006 ok here is my boat. i have the k-sport coil overs. they work, but they make noise, and i have no clue where to set anything. i know i can learnwhere to set the shocks and stuff... but i want to switch to springs and struts for a non adjustable set up. i want to be able to bolt on the suspension alignit and call it a day. any sugestions? ride height not really an issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridgeracer Posted August 6, 2006 Share Posted August 6, 2006 ok here is my boat. i have the k-sport coil overs. they work, but they make noise, and i have no clue where to set anything. i know i can learnwhere to set the shocks and stuff... but i want to switch to springs and struts for a non adjustable set up. i want to be able to bolt on the suspension alignit and call it a day. any sugestions? ride height not really an issue. I have Ksports as well. I have some suggestions to help you get rid of some of the noise issues. Just send me a PM. "Gimme mines Balboa...Gimme mines".....Clubber Lang - Mr. T Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itsme Posted August 7, 2006 Share Posted August 7, 2006 Racer X FMIC for '05-'09 LGTs, '08+ WRX and '10+ LGT,'14+ FXT, and '15+ WRX TMIC Racerxengineering.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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