G.T.Subie Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 I don't mean to bring this thread back from the dead but I just have to say after reading from page 1 it tickled me in places I didn't know I had. For the record I believe the stock brakes are almost unsafe for the speeds our cars are capable of. You just need new pads, and maybe some SS lines. Denial is your best friend Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azca Posted August 11, 2006 Author Share Posted August 11, 2006 clutch brake (downshift) and brake at the same time -> lgt stops quickly I don't mean to bring this thread back from the dead but I just have to say after reading from page 1 it tickled me in places I didn't know I had. For the record I believe the stock brakes are almost unsafe for the speeds our cars are capable of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted August 11, 2006 Share Posted August 11, 2006 Dude, give it up. You weren't down shifting if you slam on the brakes. Plus if you were at the absolute limits of the brakes with the ABS going, engine braking isn't going to help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azca Posted August 11, 2006 Author Share Posted August 11, 2006 um, what? Dude, give it up. You weren't down shifting if you slam on the brakes. Plus if you were at the absolute limits of the brakes with the ABS going, engine braking isn't going to help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenonk Posted August 11, 2006 Share Posted August 11, 2006 I would love to see a downshift of 5th to 1st.. I would love to see the tranny grind or fall out.. there's no way I can think of the clutch engaging for less than a second to make engine braking even effective let alone that a motor that is engaged still pushes the car forward, so that already makes the downshift for the engine braking worthless. Keefe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azca Posted August 11, 2006 Author Share Posted August 11, 2006 I take it, you always use your brakes only btw, some people need to learn to read carefully I would love to see a downshift of 5th to 1st.. I would love to see the tranny grind or fall out.. there's no way I can think of the clutch engaging for less than a second to make engine braking even effective let alone that a motor that is engaged still pushes the car forward, so that already makes the downshift for the engine braking worthless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robinlsb Posted August 11, 2006 Share Posted August 11, 2006 I would love to see a downshift of 5th to 1st.. I would love to see the tranny grind or fall out.. there's no way I can think of the clutch engaging for less than a second to make engine braking even effective let alone that a motor that is engaged still pushes the car forward, so that already makes the downshift for the engine braking worthless. +1000, engine braking WILL NOT improve stopping distance. "Belief does not make truth. Evidence makes truth. And belief does not make evidence." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnetic1 Posted August 11, 2006 Share Posted August 11, 2006 +1000, engine braking WILL NOT improve stopping distance. No to mention, replacing brake pads are a hell of a lot cheaper than replacing drivetrain components! Free Sonax Cleaner Deal http://www.brakeswap.com Carbotech, Hawk, PFC, DBA Rotors, Motul, Wilwood, Castrol... Great service. No bumping required ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnetic1 Posted August 11, 2006 Share Posted August 11, 2006 ROFLMAO.. I just read this thread... hilarious. Maybe we need a new section called the "Brake Kill Forum". The post has a lot of similarities to your regular kill forums. I'll give the original poster the benefit of doubt in that he did over-exaggerate his situation. Sure you may have FELT it stopped in 1 second (or less), but in reality it was longer. Does this mean LGT brakes are better than the M3? Um.. no. This kind of a comparison is completely useless. It's the same as when someone in a M3 passes a Ferrari at a HPDE and all of a sudden the M3 is faster Free Sonax Cleaner Deal http://www.brakeswap.com Carbotech, Hawk, PFC, DBA Rotors, Motul, Wilwood, Castrol... Great service. No bumping required ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crossbow Posted August 11, 2006 Share Posted August 11, 2006 Haha this thread is just classic. Thanks for the laughs. Someone buy this kid a stopwatch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenonk Posted August 11, 2006 Share Posted August 11, 2006 Was going 75mph on the freeway today, about a foot or 2 from a new M3. All of the sudden the dude in a new M3 slammed his brakes; I slammed mine immediatelly. We both went to a complete stop in no more than a second I would say. I swirved out of the lane and accelerated and kept driving; the fool kept sitting there in the left lane of the freeway... I have an LGT 06 sedan with 17" racing wheels ~13.8 pounds and Goodyear F1 tires and stock brakes. and clutch brake (downshift) and brake at the same time -> lgt stops quickly and I take it, you always use your brakes only btw, some people need to learn to read carefully what's there to read? you only type in segments and with poor grammar.. btw, some people need to learn how to type can tell a true story. For all we can make of your "clutch brake (downshift) and brake at the same time" has no real meaning to anyone, you didnt even use commas anywhere. Btw, all you had to say was "heel-toe" or "two feet in" or "threshold braking" and it would have been simpler. And even for your explanation, you still didnt "clutch off", what's the point of even saying "(downshift)" if it holds no relevance to your point? Nevertheless, your "17" racing wheels ~13.8 pounds and Goodyear F1 tires and stock brakes" will not out-stop me when I run on R-compounds on the track. I can vouch you can't stop in a matter of "no more than a second". 13.8 pound wheels, you're heavy, I run on 12.5 lbs rims on R-compounds, and there's no way you can stop from 75-0 mph in 1 second. Btw, do you know how CLOSE 2' is to a bumper? Or a 1' for that matter? You would not be able to even see their rear tires at that range or even the muffler tips. And just to make my point clear, a Mosler MT900 can't even stop from 100-0 in 1 second: Mosler Automotive http://www.moslerauto.com/images/mt900/photo/photon/photo_007.jpg Zero-to-60 mph 3.12 sec Zero-to-100 mph 7.11 sec Standing Quarter-Mile 11.02 sec @ 126.88 mph Braking 60 mph - Zero 100 ft. Braking Zero - 100 mph 3.8 sec Zero - 100 mph - Zero 10.98 sec 600 ft. Slalom 74.7 mph so I guess the Legacy GT brakes are even BETTER than a Race CAR!!1 I guess you used your powers to stop the car. or you got yourself some F1 racing 17x13 slicks Keefe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted August 11, 2006 Share Posted August 11, 2006 ^ PWNT. Azca, facts put arguments to rest quickly. Where are yours? Isaac Newton is spinning in his grave. The Crimson Dynamo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azca Posted August 11, 2006 Author Share Posted August 11, 2006 Funny thing -> you are the one with poor grammar a) READ READ AND READ. I did not use any stop watch to measure the timing nor was I claming that I did. Timing was obviously approximate and since you clearly have no engineering nor physics degree, approximate means approximate with a margin of error b) Regarding clutch braking -> I did not use clutch braking in this situation and it's very clear. I suggested to the rabydanimal that clutch braking and regular braking at same time improves braking speed/distance of already very good LGT brakes (btw very good is not perfect, not exceptional, not superb, not formula 1). If you disagree, put the gearbox into 2nd with clutch depressed at 60mph, and then bring the clutch gradually up within a second or so, you will see how much braking you will get from the clutch alone. Try that while slamming your right foot on the brakes as well. c) What's up with you giving me braking time from 100mph to 0? Braking distance quadruples with speed, period. d) Relax. You make yourself look bad arguing in this thread all the time. Makes me laugh at work Peace man. and and what's there to read? you only type in segments and with poor grammar.. btw, some people need to learn how to type can tell a true story. For all we can make of your "clutch brake (downshift) and brake at the same time" has no real meaning to anyone, you didnt even use commas anywhere. Btw, all you had to say was "heel-toe" or "two feet in" or "threshold braking" and it would have been simpler. And even for your explanation, you still didnt "clutch off", what's the point of even saying "(downshift)" if it holds no relevance to your point? Nevertheless, your "17" racing wheels ~13.8 pounds and Goodyear F1 tires and stock brakes" will not out-stop me when I run on R-compounds on the track. I can vouch you can't stop in a matter of "no more than a second". 13.8 pound wheels, you're heavy, I run on 12.5 lbs rims on R-compounds, and there's no way you can stop from 75-0 mph in 1 second. Btw, do you know how CLOSE 2' is to a bumper? Or a 1' for that matter? You would not be able to even see their rear tires at that range or even the muffler tips. And just to make my point clear, a Mosler MT900 can't even stop from 100-0 in 1 second: Mosler Automotive http://www.moslerauto.com/images/mt900/photo/photon/photo_007.jpg Zero-to-60 mph 3.12 sec Zero-to-100 mph 7.11 sec Standing Quarter-Mile 11.02 sec @ 126.88 mph Braking 60 mph - Zero 100 ft. Braking Zero - 100 mph 3.8 sec Zero - 100 mph - Zero 10.98 sec 600 ft. Slalom 74.7 mph so I guess the Legacy GT brakes are even BETTER than a Race CAR!!1 I guess you used your powers to stop the car. or you got yourself some F1 racing 17x13 slicks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PolarDog Posted August 11, 2006 Share Posted August 11, 2006 I have an engineering degree, but I gave it up to be a dancer... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted August 11, 2006 Share Posted August 11, 2006 I too have a engineering degree, mechanical. Your approximate timing was way off by about 3 seconds as PolarDog has proven. If you were threshold braking and/or have the ABS going, engine braking isn't going to do a single thing because you are at the maximum friction level of the tires, not the brakes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
praedet Posted August 11, 2006 Share Posted August 11, 2006 2 engineering degrees... If you push the brake pedal to the floor, the car stops in the same distance, and time, whether it is in gear (downshifted) or not... Everyone else 1, azca 0 A margin of error is generally less than 5% and most engineers would agree that over 10% is ludicrous. You said 1 second. Using the equation v=at+vi, where vi is your initial velocity (75 mph). Assuming that your max deceleration is about 1.25 Gs (that is where most ABS systems really start to activate, check out Stoptech’s tech articles) your time to go to zero is 2.73 seconds. A “MARGIN OF ERROR“ of 173%... ANY engineer would get fired for even approaching accuracy that bad… Everyone else 2, azca 0 Let me know when you Legacy can decelerate at 3.4 Gs, and then we can talk about margin of error. The Legacy has good brakes(everyone knows I like them ), but not that good… Ted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azca Posted August 11, 2006 Author Share Posted August 11, 2006 Ignorance is bliss. Behold. 2 engineering degrees... If you push the brake pedal to the floor, the car stops in the same distance, and time, whether it is in gear (downshifted) or not... Everyone else 1, azca 0 A margin of error is generally less than 5% and most engineers would agree that over 10% is ludicrous. You said 1 second. Using the equation v=at+vi, where vi is your initial velocity (75 mph). Assuming that your max deceleration is about 1.25 Gs (that is where most ABS systems really start to activate, check out Stoptech’s tech articles) your time to go to zero is 2.73 seconds. A “MARGIN OF ERROR“ of 173%... ANY engineer would get fired for even approaching accuracy that bad… Everyone else 2, azca 0 Let me know when you Legacy can decelerate at 3.4 Gs, and then we can talk about margin of error. The Legacy has good brakes(everyone knows I like them ), but not that good… Ted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenonk Posted August 11, 2006 Share Posted August 11, 2006 Funny thing -> you are the one with poor grammar a) READ READ AND READ. I did not use any stop watch to measure the timing nor was I claming that I did. Timing was obviously approximate and since you clearly have no engineering nor physics degree, approximate means approximate with a margin of error b) Regarding clutch braking -> I did not use clutch braking in this situation and it's very clear. I suggested to the rabydanimal that clutch braking and regular braking at same time improves braking speed/distance of already very good LGT brakes (btw very good is not perfect, not exceptional, not superb, not formula 1). If you disagree, put the gearbox into 2nd with clutch depressed at 60mph, and then bring the clutch gradually up within a second or so, you will see how much braking you will get from the clutch alone. Try that while slamming your right foot on the brakes as well. c) What's up with you giving me braking time from 100mph to 0? Braking distance quadruples with speed, period. d) Relax. You make yourself look bad arguing in this thread all the time. Makes me laugh at work Peace man. A) riiiight, your "approximation" is another word for "exaggeration" which EVERYONE here (except for you) understands. It's clearly you have no grasp of what engineering or physics are let alone about me not having a degree. Your level of "approximation" would put your car as high performing as the NASA space shuttle. Do you understand the word "exaggeration"? Or is that word too long for you to look up? If I go by your "approximation", then I can say that your IQ is as low as -25.. that's "close" to the truth right? B) see your own post, you came to a complete stop, as you said word for word. I would love to see you come to a complete stop and then drive off without needing to restart the car. Again, you are making yourself look very silly by even telling such a vague and exaggerated story in the first place. C) who said anything about distance? I showed you TIME. Again, what part are you reading? Oh wait, time and distance is the same thing, they are "approximate" according to you. D) I am relaxed, you're making me laugh along with everyone else AT YOU. Keefe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IanKen Posted August 11, 2006 Share Posted August 11, 2006 Comedy gold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenonk Posted August 11, 2006 Share Posted August 11, 2006 Ignorance is bliss. Behold. You're the ignorant one, but hey, you're also blind too cuz you can't read. Keefe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
praedet Posted August 11, 2006 Share Posted August 11, 2006 I guess I am ignorant Sorry about that folks, I am ignorant! Ignore my comments in the future because I received my Aeronautical engineering degrees from a cereal box Ted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted August 11, 2006 Share Posted August 11, 2006 Someone go race him for pinks. That'll settle it once and for all. 75 mph to 0 in 1 second. We'll give him 1.4 since that approximately rounds to 1. Even at 1.4 seconds, that's still a 2.44 g deceleration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azca Posted August 11, 2006 Author Share Posted August 11, 2006 For you educated man: Ignorance is bliss. The New Dictionary of Cultural Literacy, Third Edition. 2002 You're the ignorant one, but hey, you're also blind too cuz you can't read. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenonk Posted August 11, 2006 Share Posted August 11, 2006 I guess I am ignorant Sorry about that folks, I am ignorant! Ignore my comments in the future because I received my Aeronautical engineering degrees from a cereal box Ted 2 cereal boxes!!! Must be Lucky Charms and Bunches of "Oh S#!ts" I think I'm going to keep feeding this troll until he pukes full of the cereal that I didn't eat when I got my 4 engineering degrees, 2 physics degrees, 2 masters, and 1 PhD in automotive technology out of the boxes and my 4 racing licenses I won from Gran Tursimo video games. I GOT A SUPER LICENSE! oh wait, that's all "approximate" to azca's G.E.D. Keefe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azca Posted August 11, 2006 Author Share Posted August 11, 2006 ohoho; come over Someone go race him for pinks. That'll settle it once and for all. 75 mph to 0 in 1 second. We'll give him 1.4 since that approximately rounds to 1. Even at 1.4 seconds, that's still a 2.44 g deceleration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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