nonjo Posted July 25, 2006 Share Posted July 25, 2006 Part of the reason I bought one was that I don't know many people who have a Subby...the WRX caught my attention, but it's not the right car for me at this point. The size of the Legacy, good looks, AWD, and the rebates sucked me in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rts Posted July 25, 2006 Share Posted July 25, 2006 The sedan market is a crowded one, with players the likes of the Accord, Camry, Maxima, and previously the Taurus, just to name a few. But there aren't many wagons out there these days outside of Volvo (and they're expensive), and SOA did a nice job turning the Outback and then the Forrester into SUV competitors. With the Tribeca (blech!), the market was just too lucrative to ignore (think Porsche Cayenne), where the profit would be good enough to reinvest in things like the STI and even the Spec B. The real question that you ask, though, is why people aren't choosing the Legacy over more bland choices like the Accord and Camry, and it's a tough one to answer. I think it's inertia, mostly, not that those two venerable sedans aren't nice and reliable, but it's hard to look at one and get the visceral excitement that the new Legacies inspire. Or maybe I'm just getting old. In my opinion one factor that may drive some buyers to other makes is interior space. Rear seat space to be exact. To me the Legacy is almost a two seater. The rear seat is best reserved for smaller children. If the driver and front passenger are taller there are precious few inches of rear leg room. That is probably my biggest gripe with the Legacy. I'm over 6' and I would NOT take a long trip as a rear seat passenger in my Legacy. Don't get me wrong, I love my Legacy, but I am rarely in the situation to need to carry rear seat passengers. If I were, I doubt I'd have bought a Legacy. A family man with a growing family may need a more spacious interior. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrok Posted July 25, 2006 Share Posted July 25, 2006 Hehe, I drove people around in the back seat of my wrx. Now that is what I call a small space. The legacy seems to be plenty bigger and people who have driven in the back seat have never complained of not having enough space. The legacy isn't a 7 series bmw, it is a sports sedan (well, the gt is). It isn't meant to be huge but it isn't tiny by any means. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IwannaSportSedan Posted July 25, 2006 Share Posted July 25, 2006 Want rear seat space? 300C Long Wheelbase! I have sat in the rear seat of a Legacy GT, and it isn't too bad. Not a first class seat, but workable, especially if the front seat folks can deal with the seat an inch or two forward from the back. My wife was actually quite comfortable behind the passenger seat, which is good. she isn't quite as tall as me, and a person could probably be pretty comfortable in the right rear seat. Luckily I am buying a 4-door to be able to take occaisional rear seat passengers, not consistently. I would be considering a bigger car/van/mpv for 3-4 adults most of the time. It wasn't as bad as my dad's Grand Cherokee back seats... that is tight leg room for a vehicle that is intended to hold people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucas569 Posted July 25, 2006 Share Posted July 25, 2006 my dealer (suburban subaru) had a boat load in stock, although i will admit MOST were automatic..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerboa113 Posted July 25, 2006 Share Posted July 25, 2006 my dealer either still has or has just recently sold the red 5EAT LGT limited that I test drove last june. either that or it was the 5MT I almost test drove that was there at the same time. I dont recall. they have maybe 3-4 new legacys tho, and almost none of them are the 2.5i, infact, I dont know that I've ever seen a legacy on the lot that wasn't a GT. like your dealer however, the majority of what they have is outback wagons, usually 1 outback sedan, a ton of forresters, 1 STI and a few WRX sedans/wagons, they only have about 4 tribeccas also. We have a salesman here thats a real nice guy, the guys name is james but he goes by steve?? confusing.. hes in his 60s he told me but VERY enthusiastic about subaru. He loves to talk to customers, past or present about the vehicles and although hes new, he will eventually know everything about these cars it sounds like. My dealer is a "VOLVO/subaru" kinda dealer, they push the volvos harder because they make more sales. the other day I was talking in a chat room about subaru and how people who do not agree that its one of the most underestimated and overlooked brands on the market, have never driven one and probablly have never set foot on a subaru lot. I was called a fanboy and was told subaru "only makes 2 cars.. the outback "station wagon" and the wrx" then some other guy went on about how it only got a 3/5 where as the M3 and mercedes E class got a 5/5 in this review he was reading.. Subaru needs to ditch cherryl crow (sp) and her winding road and steal mazda's advertising guys.. at least working for subaru the cars they were calling fast and agile would actually be fast and agile. "The penalty good men pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men." - Plato Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted July 25, 2006 Share Posted July 25, 2006 Or Subaru can enter into Nascar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLegacy99 Posted July 25, 2006 Share Posted July 25, 2006 If it werent for the cost difference Id say that they would sell a million over a car like the stratus. Look for my review in the cars against the Legacy section. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboman38 Posted July 26, 2006 Share Posted July 26, 2006 I have an 8 year old and a 4 year old so I guess they are still "small" by offspring standards. Neither one has complained about npt having enough room. The LGT is definitely smaller than the Camry, Mazda6, accord and Maxima but IMHO those things are outweighed by performance and the ability to put mods on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueLeg Posted July 26, 2006 Share Posted July 26, 2006 here in grande prairie alberta i see about 5 or 6 GT sedans on a regular basis. 2 of us are on legacygt.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schneiks Posted July 26, 2006 Share Posted July 26, 2006 There was not 1 brand new 2006 LGT for sale in the state of Wisconsin (at least 4 dealers in the state that I know of) when I went looking in June. The dealer traded up for one from Illinois. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rayu Posted July 26, 2006 Author Share Posted July 26, 2006 The following is from a Subaru of America press release from early this year: The Subaru B9 Tribeca posted incremental volume totaling 14,797 units in 2005. Subaru Legacy recorded sales of 87,788 units, with Legacy Sedan sales up 14 percent for the year. Subaru Outback recorded a total of 59,570 units, while Subaru Forester posted sales of 53,541 units in 2005. Subaru Impreza posted a gain of four percent with 33,637 total units for the year, while Subaru Baja recorded 6,239 units. Could these numbers actually be correct? More Legacy's sold than Outbacks? More than Foresters? Where are all these Legacys? Here in the Boston area there is no way that Legacy's outnumber Outbacks or Foresters. Today, while biking to work on my usual 11 mile busy route from Wellesley to Boston, I counted all of the 05-06 Legacys and Outbacks that I saw. Three Outbacks, one Legacy, a ABP GT Limited sedan. If the numbers are correct, why on earth is Subaru of America cutting Legacy choices rather than expanding choices and building on what, if the numbers are to be believed, is indeed the Subaru of America flagship? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLegacy99 Posted July 26, 2006 Share Posted July 26, 2006 Yeah, I see a decent amount of Legacies, but I still see more of the BDs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DKB_SATX Posted July 26, 2006 Share Posted July 26, 2006 Rayu: The Outback is technically the Legacy Outback... so that 87,788 may be the total of Legacy sedan and wagon + outback sedan and wagon. That would leave 28,218 for Legacy sedan and wagon, less than Imprezas, Foresters and Outbacks. That's just a guess from the numbers you posted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IwannaSportSedan Posted July 26, 2006 Share Posted July 26, 2006 Legacy sales numbers includes Outback, I believe SOA accounting splits it by bodystyle, all sedans counting as legacys, all wagons counting as outbacks, and added to legacy total. Stats like this have been posted before, and IIRC, that seemed to be the breakdown. 87788-59570=28218, or ~32%. round it up to a third. (this could be legacy and outback sedan, or it could be legacy branded sedans and wagons... depending on how SOA actually does break the stats down.) Devided evenly that is 2351.5 legacys and 4964.167 outbacks per month, average, in the whole north american market. (canada, and recently mexico, included.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rayu Posted July 26, 2006 Author Share Posted July 26, 2006 That makes no sense. Subaru Media Center, where the press release originated, clearly differentiates the models the same way we and the public at large do. Check out their "At A Glance" information under "Product Information" at Subaru Media Center. I've emailed Subaru of America (SOA) to try and get some clarity. One of the telling details as to where SOA's emphasis is the fact that there are 12 different Outback models listed, from the 2.5i Wagon to the 3.0 R VDC Limited Wagon with MSRP's from $24,795 to $35,695. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IwannaSportSedan Posted July 26, 2006 Share Posted July 26, 2006 It is the difference between internal accounting and external marketing. The outback used to be marketed as an extension to the Legacy model name. Once Outback became more recognizeable of a nameplate, Subaru for some reason dropped the name "Legacy" off entirely, in favor of Outback. Internally, they are all the same "Legacy platform" regardless of the badge on the back, or the grille on the front. Also, I believe the Outback only outsells the Legacy in the North American market. In the rest of the world, I believe Legacy may have the edge, and Subaru/FHI overall still refers to the plaform as "Legacy" as a whole. Internally, the way the cars are manufactured, the Legacy wagon and outback wagon are very similar, and the only real changes are assembly parts present or not (body cladding group, suspension group, interior optional accessories group) The unibody core is the same for all the "BP" body designation wagons, regardless of tall suspension and badging or not. Similarly with the BL-designated sedans, the Legacy and Outback sedans are not much different at their core, aside from parts that are interchangeable at the manufacturing level. That is why I wonder sometimes why OBXT gets a manual trans, but LGT wagon does not any longer, same with NAV/steering wheel audio controls. Also, why there isn't a 3.0R/5EAT drivetrain option with the Legacy... All it is is one more manufacturing combination, which granted costs a bit, but could make a bit of money, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adamaxus Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 The only reason I ever found out the legacy existed is because the dealer in the city sent out an add in the mail one day. Had a picture of the Legacy on it and some of it's features, and what it was faster than ect. It was an eye grabbing ad, and when we went to buy a car 2 years later, it was still on our minds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrok Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 The only reason I ever found out the legacy existed is because the dealer in the city sent out an add in the mail one day. Had a picture of the Legacy on it and some of it's features, and what it was faster than ect. It was an eye grabbing ad, and when we went to buy a car 2 years later, it was still on our minds. And that pisses me off and I will tell you why. Dealerships should NOT have to be responsible for marketing SOA's products. Part of being in a franchise is that your marketing is taken care of by the main company. It pisses me off to no end that the only way Dealerships will sell Legacys in mass is through their own personal advertising. That is SOA's weakness as of right now Grats on getting a killer car though, and thank goodness that your dealer was willing to pony up the bucks to make that advertisement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLegacy99 Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 Agreed their commercials, TV & Radio, suck. I like the ads I see in R & T. In there every month so thats good, but Im sick of hearing Sheryl Crow. It was a good idea, but enough is enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adamaxus Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 And that pisses me off and I will tell you why. Dealerships should NOT have to be responsible for marketing SOA's products. Part of being in a franchise is that your marketing is taken care of by the main company. It pisses me off to no end that the only way Dealerships will sell Legacys in mass is through their own personal advertising. That is SOA's weakness as of right now Grats on getting a killer car though, and thank goodness that your dealer was willing to pony up the bucks to make that advertisement. they need a sweet commercial. Like that one posted here with the WRX and the rally reflection thing. You know which one i'm talking about... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dammitjim Posted August 2, 2006 Share Posted August 2, 2006 Who else offers GT AWD performance for the price? Mazdaspeed6, maybe. Volvo maybe, but neither have the chops that subaru does, and Audis are more expensive and less reliable. This is exactly why we ended up with an LGT. A WRX was the only other car we were considering, but I like the looks of the LGT better and we wanted more space. The only reason we knew about the LGT was because one of my friends started yapping about them one day. I think I keep pretty current on the cars out there, but these weren't even on my radar. Once I sat in one and drove it I all but knew we were getting one, and if my friend hadn't made a stink about them we might not have even looked at them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon in CT Posted August 2, 2006 Share Posted August 2, 2006 Could these numbers actually be correct? More Legacy's sold than Outbacks?SOA treats Outback (except for the Sport) as a subset of Legacy whenever it releases sales numbers. In order to determine true Legacy sales, subtract Outback sales from Legacy sales. For instance, Subaru just reported that it sold 8301 Legacy cars in July. 5,974 of those were Outbacks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adamaxus Posted August 3, 2006 Share Posted August 3, 2006 ']SOA treats Outback (except for the Sport) as a subset of Legacy whenever it releases sales numbers. In order to determine true Legacy sales, subtract Outback sales from Legacy sales. For instance, Subaru just reported that it sold 8301 Legacy cars in July. 5,974 of those were Outbacks. the thing is, they actually advertise the outback, not much but much more than the legacy; which gets next to 0 advertising. It's a shame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pengrus Posted August 3, 2006 Share Posted August 3, 2006 Many people said Legacy is smaller than Camry. Have you looked up their actual legroom data? I did a comparison between Legacy vs Camry, and Legacy vs Lexus RX330, and was surprised to find out that the total Leg room is about the same with Camry, and 2 inch less than RX330. The legacy has longer front leg room. But the total combined legroom is not smaller.... Can anyone else confirm this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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