BOY Posted July 18, 2006 Share Posted July 18, 2006 IMHO, not having sat radio or aux input in the 05 or 06 LGTs when you could get Hyundai's equipped that way, is just absurd. Funny, the only Acura for 06 with aux in was/is the TSX... not the TL, RL, MDX. The new 07 RDX will have the input but still no word on the others. I've sold a few 07 Foresters and not one customer has said that the deciding factor was the aux input or the Sirius radio... in fact, I've yet to sell a Sirius equipped car. Fact of the matter is, most Subaru buyers aren't luxury buyers and are already impressed at the standard feature content on most trim levels. If you're comparing Subaru's strategy to Hyundai/Kia you're nuts. Hyundai is a much larger company (worldwide) and has much more capital. As for interior/exterior choices, if you think that dealers just go out and order a particular combo you're wrong again. Dealer trade, maybe, but more likely the sales staff will flip you to an in-stock alternative choice. Trust me, I see it daily. Would a more vibrant palate be nice, yes. Would we sell more cars as a result... likely not enough to matter. My best selling Imprezas and Foresters are Crystal and Steel GRAY, Tribecas are Seacrest Green, Titanium Silver, and Black, I can't sell Legacy sedans to save my life (I dealer trade 99% of the ones I get in) and Outbacks are Silver, ABP, and Gold. Sorry, I let the customer do the talking and when I can't move the vibrant colors, and don't have any requests for them I think SOA is making the right call. Less crap sitting around my lot collecting interest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vet Posted July 18, 2006 Share Posted July 18, 2006 Maybe we can't accurately compare Subaru with the big names out there but what about a company like Mazda? How many color choices are available for the 6? I believe the 6speed even has a few unique colors in addition to the 8 or so that the regular 6 is available with. It's one thing for Subaru to have the strategy of offering fewer combinations but they need to stay somewhat competitive with the competition and they are not when it comes to colors/options/trim levels. How much cost would it add to the base if they offered 8 color choices instead of 5-6? I think they could offer all the color/trim combinations anyone would ever want and not raise the price more than $100 or so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godwhomismike Posted July 18, 2006 Share Posted July 18, 2006 I'm curious if the gas mileage on the Spec B is better or the same as the 5spd GT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godwhomismike Posted July 18, 2006 Share Posted July 18, 2006 According to the Joe Spitz website you can't get a sub/amp with navigation. IMO That's really really lame Wow that sucks!!!! The stock radio is absolute shit without the sub. Without the sub, the stock radio sounds like you're listening to an alarm clock radio. Definitely weaksauce. I'm very disappointed to hear that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EZ Rider Posted July 18, 2006 Share Posted July 18, 2006 heights, I think you make some good points. Yes, metro areas are going to be more likely to cater more towards the lux segment than a smaller area, however Subaru does not want to completely change their brand image... for example, in Washington there's only a handful of BMW/Audi/Lexus/MB dealerships outside the Seattle area while Subaru is all over the place. They are just not ready, nor do they want to I think, become an "exclusive" brand like those named above. BOY makes some excellent points and sounds like a fine representative of Subaru. If SOA starts having their sales force push the "upmarket" and luxury and leave the middle-market folks behind, they're going to lose a huge customer base. BOY knows who his customers are and takes care of them. It's hard to even compare Subaru to Mazda, since Mazda has Ford behind it. The fact is that Subaru is one of the smallest manufacturers, yet have a sizable market in the US. And here we are, discussing disadvantages of that: they're just not big enough to have the number of choices we've come to expect from larger manufacturers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenix96 Posted July 18, 2006 Share Posted July 18, 2006 In the same way that Acura sold the RSX through the NSX, there is no reason why Subaru cannot make different segments happy. I am not suggesting that Subaru develop a car like the NSX. For arguments sake, lets say that the Legacy is the halo car for SOA, they still have the Impreza series, Forester, etc. Why must anyone be left behind? There are base models of every line. It would be foolhardy to equip every LGT to the hilt. No one is suggesting Subaru turn into a BMW. Just that, people shopping 3 series and A4s/A3s seem to be looking at LGTs as well. This isnt a dichotomous situation. There is room for middle ground. Especially because the major change that I'd like to see doesn't involve throwing a trillion dollars at R&D. I want the features that Subaru *already has* to be available in the combinations people want, and it would only involve setting up a way to order a vehicle in that combination. They can keep the packages for the dealer vehicles, but if they let people pick and choose which options (and colors!) they want they'd get a lot more buyers that have otherwise overlooked Subaru - and buyers like me who would pay Subaru more money to get exactly the car I want. phoenix96 2006 Legacy GT Ltd · 2011 Outback 3.6R Ltd · 1992 SVX 2006 Outback 3.0R VDC · 2009 Forester 2.5X 2002 Outback VDC · 1996 Outback 2.5L · 1986 GL-10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOY Posted July 18, 2006 Share Posted July 18, 2006 With any luck the Toyota-ru alliance may yield cost effective ways to get more choices but right now SOA is slimming down product lines, offering much more content for less money, offering new trim levels (OB basic). I just got my 1st batch of 07 OBs in today and I have 1 XT and 1 LL bean and all I can say is WOW!!! The minor tweaks to the interiors are worlds better than anything Subaru has done before. I still stand by my belief that Subaru makes arguably the most reliable cars on the road, unquestionably the safest, and damn fun to drive, regardless of trim level and pwoerplant. Figuring the AWD alone and the premium that it requires Subarus are very appropriately priced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LegGTLT Posted July 18, 2006 Share Posted July 18, 2006 Ignore the post 'ho above you Whatever could you ever mean? Just giving the standard intro for that situation... Heights: You make some very valid points about the $35k "barrier" that Subaru is approaching and exceeding in some cases. People who they're going after in those ranges DO expect a certain level of options and choices. They wouldn't build a car that expensive unless they were going for more upmarket customers. BOY: I hear you man! I know Subaru is smaller and can't afford to ditch their bottom line/base of customers. I wouldn't expect that at all. Just on the HIGH end of their vehicle options if they could just offer a itsy, witsy, teeny, weeny, little bit more configuration is all. Could we see some pics of the new interiors on the upscale Outbacks, like the XT and LL? Just wanna see what they look like "in person" is all. Thanks! Please PM joeleodee For All Site Questions. He is the acting Admin and can resolve anything related to LegacyGT.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kostamojen Posted July 19, 2006 Share Posted July 19, 2006 Dont forget inflation. The average price for new cars being sold is $30k now I believe. (it was under $25k ~5 years ago) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IwannaSportSedan Posted July 19, 2006 Share Posted July 19, 2006 I just got my 1st batch of 07 OBs in today and I have 1 XT and 1 LL bean and all I can say is WOW!!! The minor tweaks to the interiors are worlds better than anything Subaru has done before. More specifics???? What besides the wood trim and stereo face has changed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOY Posted July 20, 2006 Share Posted July 20, 2006 More specifics???? What besides the wood trim and stereo face has changed? While I can't speak for the Legacy line the OBs now have 2 wood trim colors, one for the dark interior and one for the light. The wood is the much more standard shiny stuff but it looks GREAT. The leather feels a tad more supple but that could just be me. On the 2.5i model OBs the interiors are trimmed in aluminum only, no more wood and the fabric is right out of the Legacy, no more velour-ish in the 2.5i (maybe in the basic?). I've yet to drive the SI-Drive in the XT but I may take it home tonight to experience it, I'll report back. One of my salesmen almost sold the XT Tuesday night (it was here <3 hrs!) and said the SI-Drive made a HUGE difference... now its my turn. For those who don't know/remember, the XT has VDC now (at least with the 5AT-S) and costs more than the LLBean (which also has VDC)... it appears we've moved the XT to the halo role in the OB lineup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOY Posted July 21, 2006 Share Posted July 21, 2006 Update: I took the Beaner home last night and was not just impressed but floored at the improvements. The seats aren't just softer leather, they are down right plush now... MUCH more comfortable than 05-06. The wood trim is Lexus good and really takes the whole interior up to the level of the big-boys. The stereo is above reproach, the SRS-WoW system is hands down the best OE stereo Subaru has ever produced in the US. I'd say the sound quality is on par and arguably superior to Acura's ELS 5.1 surround DVD-A system (have to play DVD-As to get 5.1 in the Acuras). The motor feels spunkier (though it has been awhile since I've driven an H6 in anything other than a Tribeca) and the suspension feels, well, Lexus smooth (a tad underdamped and needs bigger bars, but this IS the luxo-OB, not a LGT ). I think my wife summed it up best: "This thing is too nice, I feel like I'd always be on my best behavior not to mess it up. You know, like when you visit someone's house and there's an entire room under plastic... you can look but not touch." I was cracking up! She's driven Tribecas before but said they felt/looked "tougher", like she wouldn't feel guilty getting a Tribeca dirty but would about the Bean. Long story short, despite the lack of turbo... I'd hit it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twisted Posted July 21, 2006 Share Posted July 21, 2006 see, now that kind of thing raises my ire. If we all thought that way, then we'd all be limited to buying the current model year black model T. Because we should just stop whining and suck it up. BTW, my complaint is no longer with performance, although more is always better, IMHO. Customer satisfaction and responsiveness is my quarrel with SOA. I am not satisfied with the products they offer, and it is affecting my willingness to buy their product. A good company should not be indifferent to that, and they should want my business. I am having a hard enough time considering giving up my interior color choice for my paint color preference if I should buy a new Subaru at all. Why should that dilemma exist? so that subaru can save a buck? They won't save the money they never see from lost sales. that is a lovely thing called the BOTTOM LINE. Screw your customer base at your peril, you don't make money on product you don't sell. saying "Suck it up", which IS the response I got from SOA ont this topic IS NOT CAPITALISM. If a product isn't what I don't want, I should not have to suck it up. If what I want is unattainable due to lack of realistic expectations, it is my tough luck, I know that. I don't believe this is the case with SOA here. If what I want is perfectly reasonable, but some bean counter decided the extra $.98 per unit it would cost (ficticious number, but c'mon...) then it is the bean counter's fault that the bean counter's company lost my sale completely, or lost the additional profit from me buying a lesser model, and being frustrated by it. Supply channels and expenses mean jack if the demand isn't there. How many 06 Spec Bs remain unsold out of 500, after almost a year, and recent steep discounts? Most mainstream car models (and what is more mainstream of a car than a 4-door sedan?) sell more than 500 in two weeks. Ford is in financial trouble, and they still sold more Mustangs alone this last year than subaru sold cars, TOTAL. Let alone the Taurus which still outsells the other ford cars, just to fleets! Or the F150 which until recently was the largest sales volume model in the entire US, bar none. Should Subaru really have trouble moving 500 units of a specific configuration in a whole YEAR? Maybe it isn't the lack of people spending money... but the people wanting to spend money on their terms, not strictly SOA's way or the highway, and the fact that most people wouldn't know a Legacy if their neighbor bought one. It seems unfortunate to me that Subaru is satisfied making it's usual $1 profit from it's 1% marketshare (really), when if they would spend $.25 more, they'd make $1.50 profit instead, (fake dollar numbers for illustration sake) and the customer loses out because of that decision. The customer is why SUBARU is in business. They aren't in business to give the bean counter a bean to count. Ford build previous Bullitt mustangs in three colors (NOT just dark green...), and the GT500 will be many colors. SN95 Mach 1s were several colors. new Charger "Daytonas" are at least two colors, SRT8s are three colors, CTS-V is several colors, as well. Volvo R cars have a choice, Mazdaspeed 6 has several colors, including a very nice red. Isn't even the WRX STI limited edition available in gray and white, or something? not particularly inspiring colors, but at least more than one... but they come from Japan, not SOA's backyard in Indiana. Most other "special models" on the market that are limited in quantities and not necessarily as widely distributed as their regular variants are still offered with a small choice. Despite their 'distribution channels.' Let alone if you compare the Spec B to other 30-40k sporty sedans, like Volvo, A4 Quattro, IS, and Infiniti G35. Those leave the Spec B behind the dust in terms of color choice and option availability. Legacy just has a bit of a performance edge, and better AWD than most. As was said: if subaru doesn't feel up to doing some real business, what is keeping them open? Why offer the spec B as a halo effort, put some money into the transmission, release it to the press early for some decent media exposure, and other things, and then immediately handlicap it's appeal with only one gray paint color? WHY? it isn't as if they are limiting it to WRB or Blitzen Red, both trademark colors... It isn't strictly limited production, like the 06 Spec B... They may make money. But I still think not as much as if they'd pony up and quit pulling this half-a$$ed last-minute crap, and try to sell some cars. For all the supply channel work, I can't even find more than a single new manual trans Legacy GT sedan within 200 miles. Yeah. All this cost cutting is doing wonders. +eleventy billion i just hope instead of a bean counter a decision maker at soa reads this post. Could you please send this to subaru in am e-mail or something. Everything you said is dead-on. NO car should be offered in 1 color unless it is a limited/exclusive edition. The spec B is not a limited model anymore. The color on the spec b is not the only mistake from soa that bugs me. The fact that they stopped offering Taupe interior on some LGTs also bothers me and i'm sure others here are upset over the fact that LGT waggins dont get 5MT. seriously car mfg's add options as years progress and refine things, not delete options. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twisted Posted July 21, 2006 Share Posted July 21, 2006 at least offer Garnett red (with taupe/red interior) and WRBlue on the 07 spec b u idiots at soa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IwannaSportSedan Posted July 21, 2006 Share Posted July 21, 2006 +eleventy billion i just hope instead of a bean counter a decision maker at soa reads this post. Could you please send this to subaru in am e-mail or something. Everything you said is dead-on. NO car should be offered in 1 color unless it is a limited/exclusive edition. The spec B is not a limited model anymore. The color on the spec b is not the only mistake from soa that bugs me. The fact that they stopped offering Taupe interior on some LGTs also bothers me and i'm sure others here are upset over the fact that LGT waggins dont get 5MT. seriously car mfg's add options as years progress and refine things, not delete options. Thanks, Twisted... I have sent a two letters to SOA about this topic, with these same points. They say: "we can't build one-off custom cars for customers. Wait and see, you might like the 07 anyway." Basically, we do what we want, and the customer shouldn't be so darn demanding, and just suck it up. Nice, huh. In the guy's defense, I am sure he had no input in the decision making process on the Legacy configuration list... Did I hear you right, that you are lamenting the lack of taupe interior?????????????????? What color combo are you wishing for? I would rather have a black interior, but Newport Blue doesn't come with the black... Maybe a trade is in order. Are you planning on trading up for an 07 Legacy GT? I am likely going to go used, otherwise, since 07 doesn't hold much for color combos, interior or exterior. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suds2250 Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 My dealer in Chicago had a Diamond Grey Spec B in. The service manager was annoyed I was taking pictures, plus it was already sold, so I couldn't get any interior pictures. Overall, it looks nice, and has a Spec B badge on the tail! 335HP/360Tq VF-22/1820 clone with Meth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LegGTLT Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 Front holes drilled already?!?!?!? That thing looks like an Outback from the one shot of the wheel, didn't remeber it sitting THAT high. Good job suds!!! Nice spotting and report. Please PM joeleodee For All Site Questions. He is the acting Admin and can resolve anything related to LegacyGT.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vet Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 This may be a bit off topic but I think it is related to much of the negative comments in this thread. I was checkin out VW.vortex yesterday and noticed that they've also dropped the manual trans on the Passat wagon. So Subaru isn't out in left field by doing the same with the Legacy wagon. However, the more I thought about it the more I felt as though Subaru, being a small manufacturer, should be filling those voids vacated by the big boys. A small manufacturer should be more capable and willing to get into so called niche markets. After all they shouldn't be trying to emulate the Accord and Camry. That's a futile endeavour and runs counter to Subaru's philosophy. They're not going to sell a billion manual LGT wagons but they don't need to since they're a small company. If they are the only one offering that combo in a car under 50K that may be enough of a niche for them to be profitable. There were a bunch of VW people bashing that decision and saying they now must look elsewhere for a manual wagon that doesn't cost as much as a 5 series BMW. Some of them even mentioned Subaru but that's not an option either, maybe it still is on the OB? Bottom line is that Subaru is acting like they are one of the big manufacturers when they should be taking advantage of being small; kinda like Porsche. You know none of the big compnaies would come out with something like the Cayman when they already had the Boxster. Hope this makes some sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vet Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 This may be a bit off topic but I think it is related to much of the negative comments in this thread. I was checkin out VW.vortex yesterday and noticed that they've also dropped the manual trans on the Passat wagon. So Subaru isn't out in left field by doing the same with the Legacy wagon. However, the more I thought about it the more I felt as though Subaru, being a small manufacturer, should be filling those voids vacated by the big boys. A small manufacturer should be more capable and willing to get into so called niche markets. After all they shouldn't be trying to emulate the Accord and Camry. That's a futile endeavour and runs counter to Subaru's philosophy. They're not going to sell a billion manual LGT wagons but they don't need to since they're a small company. If they are the only one offering that combo in a car under 50K that may be enough of a niche for them to be profitable. There were a bunch of VW people bashing that decision and saying they now must look elsewhere for a manual wagon that doesn't cost as much as a 5 series BMW. Some of them even mentioned Subaru but that's not an option either, maybe it still is on the OB? Bottom line is that Subaru is acting like they are one of the big manufacturers when they should be taking advantage of being small; kinda like Porsche. You know none of the big compnaies would come out with something like the Cayman when they already had the Boxster. Hope this makes some sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pathfin9 Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 My dealer in Chicago had a Diamond Grey Spec B in. The service manager was annoyed I was taking pictures, plus it was already sold, so I couldn't get any interior pictures. Overall, it looks nice, and has a Spec B badge on the tail! Did you get a shot of the window sticker? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KA81 Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 how much did it sell for? wonder if the rest of scooby dealers have their spec b's in... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kostamojen Posted July 28, 2006 Share Posted July 28, 2006 how much did it sell for? wonder if the rest of scooby dealers have their spec b's in... I checked the Northwest region today for spec-b's... nothing. There are only a few sporatic 07's right now, not very many. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gator GT Posted July 28, 2006 Share Posted July 28, 2006 New England dealerships are telling me no SpecBs until middle of August or so. argh. Seems Ernie charges $360 ontop of invoice as a 'pack fee'; possibly for ad fees and keeping the SoNE monster running. So take $32,159 and bump it up to $32,519 for total 'tentative' invoice (supposed to have Transpo and Handling incl). MSRP is coming in at $34,620. "If we are to guard against ignorance and remain free, it is the responsibility of every American to be informed." - T. Jefferson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suds2250 Posted July 28, 2006 Share Posted July 28, 2006 Sorry, I didn't get a shot of the sticker. The service guy was chasing me out of there so i had to be quick. 335HP/360Tq VF-22/1820 clone with Meth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zrrbrrt Posted July 28, 2006 Share Posted July 28, 2006 My dealer is telling me my SpecB is due in around Labor Day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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