SUBE555 Posted March 4, 2004 Share Posted March 4, 2004 My GT with KYB GR2's, Cusco STB's & rear sway, feels firm but not too hard, but in some ways it's soft, others it's hard (particularly when on that lumpy new concrete at speed.) I agree on the hard aspect Kevin, I have tried both with AutoX, and tire pressures and the little bit of give works better than the no-give and slide or bounce around factor. Kevin, you really need to head up for the Lizard, you too Zevil! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gtguy Posted March 4, 2004 Share Posted March 4, 2004 [quote name='Dr. Zevil']I have always wanted to go for a ride in your car with all those suspension goodies! I can only imagine![/quote] Believe it or not, Dr. Z, I'm still not used to it, and it's been on the car for almost two years! :lol: The differences are subtle in feel. The car is actually smoother than a stock '02-'03 WRX, because that car is oversprung for a smooth ride. The stock struts on that car also have uh, "issues." A friend has the SPT springs with the stock struts (something I tried and ultimately rejected) with the same STi rear bits that I have. His ride is significantly harsher than mine, because the car is seriously oversprung. Compared to stock, my car has hardly any steering slop (Cusco V2 brace and Gp. N control arm bushings), and turns in as if on a center pivot. It's really cool. The back end is also much more controlled than a stock car, or an otherwise stock car with just a swaybar. It's a very telepathic car now. Suffice it to say, I like it a lot, and will have one hell of a handling standard with which to compare the Legacy GT. As a side note, the '04 suspension on the WRX is excellent, much improved from the '02'-03 stuff. Kevin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Zevil Posted March 4, 2004 Share Posted March 4, 2004 Do you think that there is a good chance that you will be disappointed with the new GT suspension? I think the car will handle really well, but it's all about your point of reference. Personally I will love to get into the new GT simply because I am tired of feeling like I am driving a kid's car (wrx). I wan't something with some more class. Fortunately for me I don't have to sacrifice handling to do that. You on the other hand will more than likely be moving to a car that will seem "sloppy" in comparison. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gtguy Posted March 4, 2004 Share Posted March 4, 2004 [quote name='Dr. Zevil']Do you think that there is a good chance that you will be disappointed with the new GT suspension? I think the car will handle really well, but it's all about your point of reference. Personally I will love to get into the new GT simply because I am tired of feeling like I am driving a kid's car (wrx). I wan't something with some more class. Fortunately for me I don't have to sacrifice handling to do that. You on the other hand will more than likely be moving to a car that will seem "sloppy" in comparison.[/quote] I don't think that "disappointed" will be the appropriate characterization. I will have already adjusted my expectations by the time I get around to test-driving a GT wagon. I don't think it will be all that bad, actually. Don't forget that the GT comes with 17s, which do a lot to sharpen the handling of the WRX. It also uses a quicker steering ratio than the WRX, as well as stiffening goodies to remove slop from the steering. The only real question is suspension tuning, and I just can't imagine, given the accolades that the GT's suspension has received in other markets, that Subaru would screw that up. For example, one of my big grouses about the WRX was the fact that there seems to be a bit of lag in the steering, because of the soft control arm bushings and all of the suspension travel. By adding the Gp. N control arm bushings (which make the stockers seem like chewing gum), you gain responsiveness. Piling the Cusco V2 brace atop that, which makes a box out of the suspension x-member and the control arms, further enhances that effect by stiffening the whole front underside of the car. But with the stiffer Legacy chassis and quicker steering ratio, coupled with the smaller-diameter steering wheel and suspension tuning, plus the effect of the 17s, the Legacy should work very well. I expect it to have body roll, but so does my car. There is this mistaken notion on behalf of some folks that body roll=badness. But body roll means that the car has some suppleness, and won't bump steer, etc. I fully believe that Subaru knows what it's doing, and I believe the GT will be a very sharp handler, without question. Kevin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
titsataki Posted March 4, 2004 Share Posted March 4, 2004 But if Subaru is not so keen on knowing what it is doing on the suspension department I am sure the SPT stuff will probably fit the new Legacy just fine :) Cheers Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cotmfk Posted March 4, 2004 Share Posted March 4, 2004 [quote name='gtguy'] No. What might show up is a 3.0R, essentially Spec B suspension bits and 18" wheels with the flat six engine and the six-speed box from the STi, that Subaru showed at the Geneva auto show. I don't even think that an official STi Legacy exists in Japan yet. There have been pictures posted of a Legacy with STi plate holders and badging, but those have in fact been "tuned by STi," vs an official STi model. Kevin[/quote] Thanks for the info! Too bad to hear about the lack of an STi.... That 3.0R sounds nice, but I would prefer it to be a 2.5R with a factory turbo-charged engine! Upgrading the power is much easier that way! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cotmfk Posted March 4, 2004 Share Posted March 4, 2004 [quote name='gtguy'] Also keep in mind that hard doesn't always mean good handling. My WRX with DMS Golds with 180/180 spring rates, handled much better than the same car with Tein HAs, sporting 450/375 spring rates. My car's setup now is firm, not hard, but the handling is excellent. And they are all Subaru parts, except for a Cusco lower frame brace. Kevin[/quote] Yes, I do know this. I am just used to a nice firm ride now, and going to a soft setup makes me feel like the car is floating along.... something that is definitely NOT fun! There is a point that is too hard, and I see it all of the time on Civics in the area that are about an inch off of the ground. Their handling is no longer improved at that point!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Zevil Posted March 4, 2004 Share Posted March 4, 2004 I think that just about all of us would rather that as well. It would have to be some special package in order for me to consider the flat 6. It doesn't seem to make sense, a Spec-B package with all sorts of suspension goodies but then the added weight of the 6 cylinder. I admit I don't know the wieght difference between the 2.5 and the 3.0 but it is probably significant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Zevil Posted March 4, 2004 Share Posted March 4, 2004 [quote name='cotmfk']Yes, I do know this. I am just used to a nice firm ride now, and going to a soft setup makes me feel like the car is floating along.... something that is definitely NOT fun! There is a point that is too hard, and I see it all of the time on Civics in the area that are about an inch off of the ground. Their handling is no longer improved at that point!!![/quote] I get such a kick out of the honduh people in my area with cut springs.. so freekin' funny. Not only the bouncing, but the extreme camber on all four wheels :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gtguy Posted March 4, 2004 Share Posted March 4, 2004 It is difficult to get people to understand that what works for show cars, doesn't quite work for cars that you have to drive. I remember getting buzzed by some kids in a lowered, loud Civic, until we got to a stretch of road construction. My Legacy GT wagon, on DMS coilovers, just sailed over the rough stuff, where the kids had to apply the brakes and tip-toe over it. Suspension tuning depends upon so many variables...car weight, the geometry of the other suspension components, etc. Sport Compact Car compared two Acuras, one tuned by Honda, one by an aftermarket company. The aftermarket one was all stiff and stuff, but the softer, Honda-tuned one performed better both around town, AND on the track, which is where people often think that stiff suspensions have an advantage. Kevin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kage Posted March 4, 2004 Share Posted March 4, 2004 The "ricer" crowd just prove over and over again the old adage that a little knowledge is very dangerous. Stiff suspension good? Stiffer suspension better! Lower good? So low your tires rub better! Big wheels good? Dubs better! Free exhaust good? Fart can better! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cotmfk Posted March 5, 2004 Share Posted March 5, 2004 [quote name='Dr. Zevil']I think that just about all of us would rather that as well. It would have to be some special package in order for me to consider the flat 6. It doesn't seem to make sense, a Spec-B package with all sorts of suspension goodies but then the added weight of the 6 cylinder. I admit I don't know the wieght difference between the 2.5 and the 3.0 but it is probably significant.[/quote] Well, I would love the 3.0..... if IT came turbocharged from the factory. Now that would be sweet! :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUBE555 Posted March 5, 2004 Share Posted March 5, 2004 And Kevin, that's why the JDM STi I believe got softened up a little bit for this year! Arai proved it was faster with a little softer suspension. Sometimes a little give is more traction. BTW, the EZ30 only weighs about 30lbs more than the EJ25. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cotmfk Posted March 5, 2004 Share Posted March 5, 2004 [quote name='SUBE555'] BTW, the EZ30 only weighs about 30lbs more than the EJ25. :)[/quote] Is that NA v.s NA, or is it an NA EZ30 and a turbo EJ25? Just curious... If it's NA vs NA, then that is impressive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUBE555 Posted March 5, 2004 Share Posted March 5, 2004 NA - NA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cotmfk Posted March 6, 2004 Share Posted March 6, 2004 Nice! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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