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2017 Legacy 2.5i premium with off-center steering wheel


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Got it in 2020 as cert pre-owned and after a few days I started to notice something was up. While driving, it seems like the steering wheel wants to be a little off-center to the right- like just between 12 and 1 o'clock. I've only owned a much older vehicle prior to this one and haven't driven many newer cars so I thought this might be something normal for newer vehicles. Nevertheless, I took it to a Subaru dealer, they say it needs an alignment- and afterwards the car continued to pull to the right. So later, I took it to a independent shop and after just a quick drive down the street they confirmed that the steering wheel is off-center. He said it's an alignment issue and if the alignment is indeed all correct, than the steering wheel should be fixed at 12 o'clock while driving. I have measurement printouts from Subaru and another shop I took it to confirming alignment is all correct. I don't really understand this because I thought that alignment has to do with the positioning of the wheels and not really related to the steering assembly/performance?

Just looking for info on the technicals of this issue, if/how it can be fixed, how expensive...etc. I have an appointment at a Subaru dealer in a few days but I'm wondering if by chance It may be a relatively simple fix I could do myself. 

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If an alignment is done properly, the wheel will point straight up.  It requires that the front toe bet set to spec at the same tie at the same time as the wheel points up; this is done by adjusting the steering linkage.  You could do it yourself if you carefully adjust the tie rods by exactly the same amount in opposite directions until the wheel is centered; however, you will have no way of knowing whether the toe is out of adjustment.  The centering of the wheel can only be assessed by a road test - it can't be seen on the rack unless it's grossly out of adjustment.  Some shops will call it good enough if it's fairly close so they won't have to put the car back on the rack for a mini-alignment (front toe only).

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On 1/25/2023 at 1:45 PM, Tom Pearl said:

While driving, it seems like the steering wheel wants to be a little off-center to the right- like just between 12 and 1 o'clock ...  I took it to a Subaru dealer, they say it needs an alignment- and afterwards the car continued to pull to the right. So later, I took it to a independent shop and after just a quick drive down the street they confirmed that the steering wheel is off-center.

You seem to be describing two different problems. Which is it? Steering wheel not centered when driving straight? Car steers to the right when steering wheel is released? Either way, there's a TSB for that.

TSB_04-19-17_Steering_Pull_171227.pdf

"If you don't know where you're going, any road will take you there." ~ The Cheshire Cat (Alice in Wonderland)

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2 hours ago, Tom Pearl said:

The steering wheel is not centered when driving straight which im just assuming is the reason the car pulls to the right when the wheel is released when driving straight- even while on a flat, level road.

Depends on the road, if it is crowned like most roads, you will drift right because it's "downhill" (to help water runoff).

If you are more than slowly drifting, then the alignment is likely off.

 

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According to 3 different shops the alignment is fine. And I just now realised that if the car pulls to the right when driving straight and not holding the wheel, than centering the steering wheel isnt going to solve the problem, right?

So I'm thinking this boils it down to a suspension issue or something up with the steering linkage or power steering.

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4 hours ago, Tom Pearl said:

According to 3 different shops the alignment is fine. And I just now realised that if the car pulls to the right when driving straight and not holding the wheel, than centering the steering wheel isnt going to solve the problem, right?

Right.

If you have EyeSight, verify that Lane Keeping Assist is turned off.

Quote

So I'm thinking this boils it down to a suspension issue or something up with the steering linkage or power steering.

I would look at tire wear patterns next. Do you perhaps have mixed tires (different sizes or types), or do you have asymmetric or directional tires mounted incorrectly? Have you checked tire pressures with a known-accurate gauge?

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"If you don't know where you're going, any road will take you there." ~ The Cheshire Cat (Alice in Wonderland)

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9 hours ago, Tom Pearl said:

Not mixed. All Primewell PS830/850. I don't know if they're directional, asymmetrical or what. Today the dealership inflated all tires to specs

Today? After the alignments? Tire pressure should be set before an alignment.  Can you upload your alignment sheets? If you had it aligned at a dealer and it's still not fixed... so long as you complained of your steering wheel being off center and not just telling them you want an alignment, take it back to them since they haven't fixed your complaint.

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I didn't get an alignment. It doesn't need one according to the dealership's machine. I asked for a printout but they said the system was down at the time. Ill probably take it back one more time but I mean... Ive already taken it to them 4 times and the issue still isn't resolved. This is why I'm kinda at a loss at this point and starting to feel like its not worth the trouble. My next step is actually find a legacy from the same gen as mine at a dealer somewhere and test drive it to see if is just a thing with those cars and not actually an issue.

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Is it a torque steer issue?  Does it pull to the right while you are accelerating or when ever you let go of the wheel?  

I can sense ur frustration..  To keep ur sanity how about rotating ur tires urself?  Put the back tires on the front switching sides and put the front tires on the back keeping them on the same sides ..   So rear right put on left fron and rear left put on right front and move front wheel to back keeping them on the sides they already are..  Thats my best suggestion..

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Not sure what you mean by torque steer issue but yes the more I accelerate the more pronounced the pull becomes. At low speeds its hardly noticeable and over 65ish its so pronounced I have to keep a hand on the wheel and turn a little to the left every few seconds to stay in my lane. But overall its a pretty slight and steady pull. I almost wouldn't even call it a "pull" ... Its more like a steady drift to the right. Feels almost like the right side of the car is lagging behind the left like the car had a stroke or something lol. Or the front axle is at a slight angle instead of level/ perfectly perpendicular with the driveshaft.

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3 hours ago, Beamercub said:

How about taking the wheel off and centering it?  Done.

Not a good idea, unless you're prepared to perform a full recalibration of the electric power steering. The position of the steering wheel must match the steering angle sensor in the steering column.

"If you don't know where you're going, any road will take you there." ~ The Cheshire Cat (Alice in Wonderland)

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2 hours ago, ammcinnis said:

Not a good idea, unless you're prepared to perform a full recalibration of the electric power steering. The position of the steering wheel must match the steering angle sensor in the steering column.

This is true.  SSM is required to zero the steering angle sensor after any work related to steering is performed.

 

On 1/25/2023 at 11:45 AM, Tom Pearl said:

I took it to a Subaru dealer, they say it needs an alignment- and afterwards the car continued to pull to the right. So later, I took it to a independent shop and after just a quick drive down the street they confirmed that the steering wheel is off-center. He said it's an alignment issue and if the alignment is indeed all correct, than the steering wheel should be fixed at 12 o'clock while driving. I have measurement printouts from Subaru and another shop I took it to confirming alignment is all correct.

 

.....

5 hours ago, Tom Pearl said:

I didn't get an alignment.

What?

 

Any thing off with the alignment causing a pull will obviously be more pronounced as you go faster.  Torque steer is what happens when you mash the gas and the steering wheel seemingly turns on its own. I have a 2017 with 60k (purchased Oct '22) and I do not have any issues with it pulling to one side. I did an alignment just out of boredom shortly after I got it and I did find a few things out of spec but there were no indications I NEEDED the alignment from driving it.

Edited by silverton
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To be clear: I've had three alignments done.

First was at a random alignment shop. This reduced the amount of pull slightly. I have a printout of the "after" measurements from this visit but lost the "before" measurements. 

Next, I took it too a Subaru dealership where they performed an alignment because their machine indicated the measurements were still a bit off. I confirmed this through the display monitor behind the service desk but did not get a printout. This alignment made no noticeable difference and car continued to pull. 

Next, I took it to a random shop and they're machine said all good measurements. Did not get a printout or see the readings but saw them getting the readings.

Next, about a month later, I took it to another random shop. Their machine showed that some measurements were off slightly. The camber on the front driver's side I believe, but don't remember 100%. They did an alignment and it made maybe the slightest noticeable difference but the car continues to pull. I visually confirmed everything by looking at the readings on their computer but did not get a printout. 

Most recently I took it back to the same dealership and their machine shows all measurements are perfect but they said their printer was down at the time and could not give me a printout.

So, from all this I gather that all alignment measuring machines aren't created equally... and I keep going back to the first reply to my original post which states that a truly proper alignment maybe hasn't been performed.

Edited by Tom Pearl
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If you're in the pacific northwest, seattle specifically, i'd be more than happy to visually inspect it for you and see what my alignment machine says.

Admittedly I noticed my car pulling to the right last night and I was having to hold steady left tension to stay straight, but it was downhill on a crowned surface, miles later on a flat surface it was fine.  My first thought was "tom jinxed me!"

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I'm in Southern CA, but thanks for the kind offer.

Im thinking my next step will be finding a couple legacys of the same gen in my area and test driving them to see if they do the same thing as mine because there's people telling me that most newer cars drift slightly to the right as a safety feature in case the driver falls asleep they go off the road instead of into oncoming traffic. I'm thinking there might be some truth to that because besides this car I've only owned a couple from the late 90s and they drove straight as an arrow. And the few newer cars I've driven besides mine also drifted to the right slightly.

However, you're saying your 2017 doesn't pull at all so it might just end up being a waste of time.

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On 1/31/2023 at 2:09 PM, Tom Pearl said:

Not sure what you mean by torque steer issue but yes the more I accelerate the more pronounced the pull becomes. At low speeds its hardly noticeable and over 65ish its so pronounced I have to keep a hand on the wheel and turn a little to the left every few seconds to stay in my lane. But overall its a pretty slight and steady pull. I almost wouldn't even call it a "pull" ... Its more like a steady drift to the right. Feels almost like the right side of the car is lagging behind the left like the car had a stroke or something lol. Or the front axle is at a slight angle instead of level/ perfectly perpendicular with the driveshaft.

Again, I sense ur frustration.  I have almost lost my mind dealing with handling issues of my car.  I'll go thru the list of things I have done to make my car handle "better".      

- Check wheel bearings  ( All of mine have been replaced by now - first bearing replaced at 7k miles )  @ 114k currently

-  Rear differential was replaced at 21k miles.  ( felt like car was having a stroke on the highway )

- RSB ( Rear sway bar upgrade )

*Being that you bought the car used in 22'  take a peek back in the history of posts on here and you might get some relief.

Alot of owners had similar problems with handling issues with the Legacy, but that was years ago..  Most have probally moved on from the car by now.   

My car still isn't completely right..   I have a 2015 and my saving grace is that lane keep assist wasn't offered until 2016 😃

 

***  How about new tires**   ?

 

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I got the car in late 2020, not 2022. I've taken it to the same Subaru dealership 4 times since and each time they apparently did a full inspection of the vehicle and each time I left with nothing being resolved. During a full inspection they should check all the things you list, right? I'm starting to feel like this particular dealership is pretty incompetent. Every time I go there its 50% people just getting minor services done like oil change, tire rotation...etc and 50% pissed off customers bitching at them about more involved issues that aren't getting resolved. Got brand new tired Jan 22 so they're fine.

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On 2/1/2023 at 3:43 PM, Tom Pearl said:

... there's people telling me that most newer cars drift slightly to the right as a safety feature in case the driver falls asleep they go off the road instead of into oncoming traffic.

BS. Anecdotally, neither my 2015 Legacy nor 2016 Outback (each with ~60,000 miles on the original factory alignment) drift left or right, except perhaps in cases of unusually pronounced lateral slope of the road surface.

"If you don't know where you're going, any road will take you there." ~ The Cheshire Cat (Alice in Wonderland)

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  • 2 weeks later...

Update:

I recently drove another 2017 Legacy and it was perfect. No weird pull to the right and didn't at all feel like something is off like with mine. 

After reading this thread, I'm pretty convinced the issue lies in the steering components: https://community.cartalk.com/t/steering-is-harder-to-the-left-than-to-the-right/83146

I'll be taking it to Subaru for the final time in about a week and if nothing comes of it again than I'm not putting any more time and money into the car and moving on. Ill give an update.

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