apokalypse Posted October 6, 2019 Share Posted October 6, 2019 Had a beauty of a day in Ontario to start removing parts on my Legacy GT to replace the timing belt. I've got all the covers off, after cursing and swearing at the charge pipe that didn't want to disconnect. My problem is that I can't see a reference mark for the crank gear to align with. When I rotated the crank clockwise, it's found it's sweet spot and the marking is facing up, but both the left and right pulleys are off slightly. If I apply pressure on the crank bolt to make it rotate slightly more clockwise, then I can make the right and left pulley markings align, but after releasing pressure they slip back to being misaligned. Is this just a case of the belt stretching and it's still mostly timed? Do I need to take any precautions at this point? I haven't released the belt yet, it's still tensioned. Just trying to figure out what my next steps are when I pull the belt... do I just align the markings by rotating pulleys slightly clockwise, and put the new belt on? Photos @ https://photos.app.goo.gl/XYjhgbKkNHmvYG9PA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poconoracing Posted October 6, 2019 Share Posted October 6, 2019 The driver side upper cam is likely to move anyway as soon as you pull the belt off. Make sure you have an Allen key to turn the cam pulleys before you get into it. Make sure the crank is correct and pull the belt. If the crank is correct the pistons are mid stroke and will not contact the valves. This is a great video on how to set the timing when you install the new belt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLlegacy Posted October 6, 2019 Share Posted October 6, 2019 Exactly what pocono said, with the crank marks aligned the engine will be in a safe position for the valves not to hit the pistons. There is a cam lock tool that would keep the cams lined up while installing the new belt, but if its too late for that I am sure you can find a good answer on youtube, plenty of DIY help there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apokalypse Posted October 6, 2019 Author Share Posted October 6, 2019 https://photos.app.goo.gl/pqNDkdMHDGtmc5e69 What am I supposed to align this to? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stewdogg Posted October 6, 2019 Share Posted October 6, 2019 https://photos.app.goo.gl/pqNDkdMHDGtmc5e69 What am I supposed to align this to? You have it lined up correctly. The mark your looking for is faintly on the rounded piece of aluminum thats oxidizing a bit above the pulley. I'm sure you could wire brush it a bit and it might show up better...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apokalypse Posted October 6, 2019 Author Share Posted October 6, 2019 You have it lined up correctly. The mark your looking for is faintly on the rounded piece of aluminum thats oxidizing a bit above the pulley. I'm sure you could wire brush it a bit and it might show up better...? Yeah, I'll try that tomorrow. I scraped at it a bit but nothing jumped out. I was just worried of doing something wrong at this juncture since both sides appear to be off, but aligned if I rotate it a bit more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stewdogg Posted October 6, 2019 Share Posted October 6, 2019 My WRX and XT lined up better than the GT. Mine were off a bit on the GT too, but not as far as yours. This tool helps a ton when putting things back together. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07N4GVR7Z/ref=sspa_dk_detail_1?psc=1&spLa=ZW5jcnlwdGVkUXVhbGlmaWVyPUFQSExMSFJPSDRESjcmZW5jcnlwdGVkSWQ9QTA3Njc0NjdHUE8wR1NXSkdHUEwmZW5jcnlwdGVkQWRJZD1BMDUwNTIyMjJRV0Q1RUdZNEFZS0kmd2lkZ2V0TmFtZT1zcF9kZXRhaWwyJmFjdGlvbj1jbGlja1JlZGlyZWN0JmRvTm90TG9nQ2xpY2s9dHJ1ZQ== That right side likes to advance or relax back in place with the slightest touch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moral hazard Posted October 6, 2019 Share Posted October 6, 2019 Mine were off a bit on the GT too, but not as far as yours. Likewise. I wouldn't be too concerned. Get the new belt on as best you can. I followed the service manual and also this video: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgoodhue Posted October 6, 2019 Share Posted October 6, 2019 The notch is slighltly to the right for the crank gear, which will should line up the cams closer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apokalypse Posted October 6, 2019 Author Share Posted October 6, 2019 The notch is slighltly to the right for the crank gear, which will should line up the cams closer. You have it lined up correctly. The mark your looking for is faintly on the rounded piece of aluminum thats oxidizing a bit above the pulley. I'm sure you could wire brush it a bit and it might show up better...? I was able to remove some grime, and lo and behold the notch appeared. Right now it's not perfectly aligned (the gear is a hair to the left of the notch), but I guess if I install a fresh belt properly, it will be? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apokalypse Posted October 6, 2019 Author Share Posted October 6, 2019 Whelp, I didn't have my vice grips clamped enough to prevent the driver side cams from staying put and they sprung free. https://photos.google.com/share/AF1QipMyjYjkAsCZ0g8ktG5v83dqifBT6NBp_lTtjJ8O9mnY_5wDkgEdZtz--fFHHHFQ4A/photo/AF1QipOkCNOaxKsE7vmi1XR3qfWcv2aASbupSEpLY4Re?key=Vmk5TVFOcHgzZndjb0gtME1WY1FsY1RyNktBb25R I should just be able to rotate the exhaust counter-clockwise, and the intake clockwise until they are re-timed, right? I had borrowed a plastic cam lock tool but it didn't end up fitting over the exhaust due to the lip. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgoodhue Posted October 7, 2019 Share Posted October 7, 2019 Whelp, I didn't have my vice grips clamped enough to prevent the driver side cams from staying put and they sprung free. https://photos.google.com/share/AF1QipMyjYjkAsCZ0g8ktG5v83dqifBT6NBp_lTtjJ8O9mnY_5wDkgEdZtz--fFHHHFQ4A/photo/AF1QipOkCNOaxKsE7vmi1XR3qfWcv2aASbupSEpLY4Re?key=Vmk5TVFOcHgzZndjb0gtME1WY1FsY1RyNktBb25R Just get the tool linked above. It is going to be really hard to line them back up without. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrD123 Posted October 7, 2019 Share Posted October 7, 2019 Are the plugs still installed? Pressure in the cylinders can make it easier for the crank sprockets to spin. I think you want to remove the covers on the two pulleys so that you can turn them easier with a hex key. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apokalypse Posted October 7, 2019 Author Share Posted October 7, 2019 Just get the tool linked above. It is going to be really hard to line them back up without. Sadly the one above is not for sale on Amazon Canada, but I found something similar that will show up tomorrow. I'm also replacing the water pump, and I tried removing the bottom WP bolt that secures the heat shield to it without dropping the donwpipe, as the nuts on the turbo bolts are all rusted. I think the bolt threads are now cheesed, as it's not backing out anymore. I'm going to hacksaw that out tomorrow and cut a little channel in the heat shield so I can work with the clearance that I have - will upload photos tomorrow. Whoever thought that placement was a good idea needs to give their head a shake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apokalypse Posted October 7, 2019 Author Share Posted October 7, 2019 Are the plugs still installed? Pressure in the cylinders can make it easier for the crank sprockets to spin. I think you want to remove the covers on the two pulleys so that you can turn them easier with a hex key. Yeah, the plugs are still installed. That's correct, I'll need to remove those two covers to get access to the bolt to rotate the cams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrD123 Posted October 7, 2019 Share Posted October 7, 2019 sorry - typo in my post - should have said cam sprockets/pulleys! (the crank pretty much stays where you put it with the timing belt off!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgoodhue Posted October 7, 2019 Share Posted October 7, 2019 Sadly the one above is not for sale on Amazon Canada, but I found something similar that will show up tomorrow. I'm also replacing the water pump, and I tried removing the bottom WP bolt that secures the heat shield to it without dropping the donwpipe, as the nuts on the turbo bolts are all rusted. I think the bolt threads are now cheesed, as it's not backing out anymore. I'm going to hacksaw that out tomorrow and cut a little channel in the heat shield so I can work with the clearance that I have - will upload photos tomorrow. Whoever thought that placement was a good idea needs to give their head a shake It is easier to drop the whole exhaust manifold with the turbo and downpipes attached. You can slide a 10mm wrench to remove that bolt, but it doesn't really do you any good, you still need to drop the downpipe to get to the oil cooler bolt near the back of the water pump. The low mount turbo makes the waterpump difficult. The 5th Gen Legacy is the only EJ255 variation like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apokalypse Posted October 8, 2019 Author Share Posted October 8, 2019 It is easier to drop the whole exhaust manifold with the turbo and downpipes attached. You can slide a 10mm wrench to remove that bolt, but it doesn't really do you any good, you still need to drop the downpipe to get to the oil cooler bolt near the back of the water pump. The low mount turbo makes the waterpump difficult. The 5th Gen Legacy is the only EJ255 variation like this. Yeah, as I started down that path I just realized you're right... gah. I didn't notice the oil cooler tucked in the backside Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apokalypse Posted October 8, 2019 Author Share Posted October 8, 2019 (edited) Is there enough room to get the exhaust/turbo out without removing the center exhaust pipe, if I can get it disconnected at the cat? edit: nm, the one nut is so rusted it's not even worth trying. Edited October 8, 2019 by apokalypse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgoodhue Posted October 8, 2019 Share Posted October 8, 2019 Is there enough room to get the exhaust/turbo out without removing the center exhaust pipe, if I can get it disconnected at the cat? edit: nm, the one nut is so rusted it's not even worth trying. It is not that hard to remove the center pipe assembly, one support bolt and 2 bolt to the catback portion. The support also has a hook to hold up the exhaust on that end to make it easier to reassemble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apokalypse Posted October 8, 2019 Author Share Posted October 8, 2019 It is not that hard to remove the center pipe assembly, one support bolt and 2 bolt to the catback portion. The support also has a hook to hold up the exhaust on that end to make it easier to reassemble. Yeah, I see that too. Was just hopeful Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apokalypse Posted October 13, 2019 Author Share Posted October 13, 2019 Well... that was an exciting time (ha ha! timing belt) 3/6 nuts pulled out the studs from the exhaust manifold. Got new studs/nuts and gaskets. New AVCS cover gaskets. A new bolt for the muffler hanger that snapped off when I tried to remove it (still need to drill it out). But worst of all.. finally with a second set of hands I was able to get the flare nut back on the oil line from the turbo to the scavenge pump. This was by far the worst challenge (aside from having to drop the exhaust for that water pump line). All in all it was a good experience, but what a pain to get that water pump out! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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