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Is Subaru Axing Legacy 3.6R?


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Its about time and very likely at some point in the near future, possibly when the 7th gen Legacy and 6th gen Outback fleet is rolled out... if they do at all (might just be axed and replaced with whatever becomes a 2nd gen Levorg).

 

We've been talking about this (H6 RIP) happening for at least 5 years, leading up to the BN/BS release. Didnt happen there (too many pre-manufactured engines that needes to be sold off wrapped in the newer sheet metal) but all too likely to happen now.

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I concur. I'd be very surprised to see it survive the Gen7 refresh expected in 2020. But, I do like the "battle tested" status of the engine. If I had a choice, I take the H6 over a Turbo-4, but I'm sure both are quite capable machines.

 

The bigger question is if they drop it for MY2019, since they're producing so many FA24DIT's for the Ascent, if/when they'll trickle down to the Outback/Legacy as an alternate engine option.

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I think they'll hold off with such decisions until MY2020 7th-gen Legacy / 6th-gen Outback.

2019 3.6R might be the last year you can get your hands on a new OE 3.6R + HT-CVT combo in any Subaru.

 

Its very likely, almost inevitable, that the FA24DIT will make its way into both the Legacy/Outback and possibly new STI (where it will likely be coupled with some type of soft-hybrid setup)

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I like the 6.

Turbo 4 is nice and fun, but longevity is key, turbos when you put a good amount of miles and your warranty runs out can become very expensive.

 

I wanted the 2010 2.5GT really bad, but at that time I was very young so my insurance would have been astronomical. So 2.5i for the last 8 years.

 

The 3.6R power delivery is adequate.

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I pay the same for the GT as the Odyssey, well actually the Odyssey is a little more on insurance. And if you look at what manufacturers have done recently with small turbo engines the anecdotal opinion of turbo longevity collapses. It is only when you start pushing those turbos harder than they were intended to be pushed do they start to breakdown at a faster rate.
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Really? I'd rather have a 6 than a turbo 4. That's just me though.

 

I like the 6.

Turbo 4 is nice and fun, but longevity is key, turbos when you put a good amount of miles and your warranty runs out can become very expensive.

 

I would prefer the turbo 4. As for the longevity, it probably depends on how long you plan on owning it. I personally get pretty nervous about buying an used turbo Subaru with 150k miles on it.

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Yes, I agree, the modern turbos have come a long way, certainly. However, my opinion of any turbo is that you're adding more parts to the engine. There's a beauty in the simplicity of any NA engine. DI is introducing some new issues we didn't consider (valve carbon issues), but I'm sure in time all engines will be DI, with hopefully some type active PI+DI design now that Toyota has made the technology known to other players.

 

Techron & stuff with PEA should work for the FI's, but won't help the rear of the valve problem.

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The problem with new turbo 4's is they are built for economy not performance and with the use of load based tuning, its a "you get boost when I feel like it". There are notable exceptions (WRX/STI, ST/RS) but don't count on the 2.4DIT to be a barn burner if they use it in the Legacy and I would not be surprised if that 2.4 became a 2.0.

 

Until Subaru realizes it's not 2005 with DI and CVT and moves to 2018 with 7 and up speed Automatics and better DI with MPI to keep the valves from getting carbon wads built up, they are going to be learning lessons the industry has all ready burdened and learned from, the hard way.

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The 3.6R is more of a trim level than it is a model. So no, they won't kill the trim level, but it will almost certainly get a new name that doesn't reference the displacement any longer.
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The problem with new turbo 4's is they are built for economy not performance and with the use of load based tuning, its a "you get boost when I feel like it". There are notable exceptions (WRX/STI, ST/RS) but don't count on the 2.4DIT to be a barn burner if they use it in the Legacy and I would not be surprised if that 2.4 became a 2.0.

 

Until Subaru realizes it's not 2005 with DI and CVT and moves to 2018 with 7 and up speed Automatics and better DI with MPI to keep the valves from getting carbon wads built up, they are going to be learning lessons the industry has all ready burdened and learned from, the hard way.

 

Is that "hard" lesson the one of sales records year over year...cause I feel so bad for them making all that money off their popular vehicles. Having to live with the stigma of having the best CVT on the market...:p

 

I can't recall anyone calling a 3 passenger suv or van a barn burner. It fits perfectly into the segment and should push the envelope if only slightly with fuel economy and performance slightly ahead of the pack especially with the equipment and price point.

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2019 3.6R might be the last year you can get your hands on a new OE 3.6R + HT-CVT combo in any Subaru.

 

If they make it in a Touring trim level with the acoustic glass, heated steering wheel, steering responsive LED headlights etc like the Outback we'll let the 2011 go no problem.

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2019 3.6R might be the last year you can get your hands on a new OE 3.6R + HT-CVT combo in any Subaru.

 

If they make it in a Touring trim level with the acoustic glass, heated steering wheel, steering responsive LED headlights etc like the Outback we'll let the 2011 go no problem.

 

The 2018 Limited 3.6 has all that already except for the steering wheel heat.

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He didn't say anything about a 2.4 hybrid STI, (I wasn't asking) but the SOA rep at the Baltimore car show told me that the new Legacy would be a 2020, on the global platform and with the 2.4.

 

I think they'll hold off with such decisions until MY2020 7th-gen Legacy / 6th-gen Outback.

2019 3.6R might be the last year you can get your hands on a new OE 3.6R + HT-CVT combo in any Subaru.

 

Its very likely, almost inevitable, that the FA24DIT will make its way into both the Legacy/Outback and possibly new STI (where it will likely be coupled with some type of soft-hybrid setup)

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Is that "hard" lesson the one of sales records year over year...cause I feel so bad for them making all that money off their popular vehicles. Having to live with the stigma of having the best CVT on the market...:p

 

I can't recall anyone calling a 3 passenger suv or van a barn burner. It fits perfectly into the segment and should push the envelope if only slightly with fuel economy and performance slightly ahead of the pack especially with the equipment and price point.

 

Sure they made money, then lost profit in the cost of quality through warranty replacement. Extending the warranty to 100k or whatever it is tells me they feel the CVT's doesn't have longevity and placed fear in loosing customers over it. Some where along the line they lost confidence in it and are likely either too invested in CVT or no one wants to be the guy to pull the plug.

 

It will be interesting to see how well it does in the Ascent, being the heaviest vehicle and the largest liter turbo engine Subaru has put a CVT in. Only time will tell.

Edited by nads
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Sure they made money, then lost profit in the cost of quality through warranty replacement. Extending the warranty to 100k or whatever it is tells me they feel the CVT's doesn't have longevity and placed fear in loosing customers over it. Some where along the line they lost confidence in it and are likely either too invested in CVT or no one wants to be the guy to pull the plug.

 

It will be interesting to see how well it does in the Ascent, being the heaviest vehicle and the largest liter turbo engine Subaru has put a CVT in. Only time will tell.

Apparently you have been hiding in a hole since 2015 when Subaru put the HT CVT on the 3.6 legacy and outback...

 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G920A using Tapatalk

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From the complaints I have seen on the forums, most of the problems with the CVT are with the 2010 and 2011 torque converters. I do think Subaru extended the warranty on 2010-2015 to in still confidence in the CVT to the owners. I don't think they lost money on the warranty replacement as I don't think the failure are that widespread beyond the TC lock failures of the early models. I would guess Subaru has lost a lot more money on the FB engine warranty replacements for oil consumption than the CVT replacements.
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