Blake32604 Posted December 1, 2017 Share Posted December 1, 2017 New to the forum, and forums in general. If this is the wrong place to post, hep a brother out and point me in the right direction. Here it goes: '09 Legacy SOHC 2.5 w/~94,000 died with a loud bang while driving to work. Took it to a independent shop. Timing belt was broken, I had them put a new one on and now there is no compression with air coming out of intake and exhaust (both valves bent?) The timing belt was replaced 9,000 miles ago at a subaru dealer with customer supplied parts(I know, I did a lot of things wrong) Bought the kit from evergreen on amazon. They were replacing the cam seals, water pump, rear main seal, head gasket seals and a few other things under CARMAX warranty so we figured why not slap a T-belt on it so we dont have to pay the labor again when its due in a couple thousand miles. We are trying to have it towed to Subaru to see if it might be something they did wrong. They replaced CV axles and forgot to tighten the axle nut last time we were there, which is the reason I didnt have the car towed there in the first place. Everything I have seen in repair manuals say the SOHC motor is NON-interference. How did the valve bend if they dont touch the piston, or is it even the valves? Any ideas? Thanks in advance! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wasted Potential Posted December 1, 2017 Share Posted December 1, 2017 Pretty sure 97 and newer SOHC are interference motors. Only 2.2l not interference. Curious if the belt failed or they actually did something clever... I mean dumb. Even if the belt failed, make sure to get it before they do something to it. I can imagine them cutting it after removal to point blame on the part. I assume tensioner fail. What's the mileage recommendation for the timing belt, I thought it was 90k.. Did carmax tell you it had not been done? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JmP6889928 Posted December 1, 2017 Share Posted December 1, 2017 I wonder about timing-did this shop put the belt on correctly? Pretty tough to screw up SOHC timing but it can be done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ehsnils Posted December 1, 2017 Share Posted December 1, 2017 Only way to know is to tear down the motor and inspect every item while doing that to both figure out the root cause and to assess the damage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xt2005bonbon Posted December 1, 2017 Share Posted December 1, 2017 Have a look if they had the timing belt guides placed too close to the belt. Happened to me and belt overheated and skipped a few teeth. Luckily no bent valves for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blake32604 Posted December 1, 2017 Author Share Posted December 1, 2017 What's the mileage recommendation for the timing belt, I thought it was 90k.. Did carmax tell you it had not been done? I have had the car since 2011. Since they were in doing the seals and water pump under warranty, I bought the T-belt kit for them to put on at around 84,000 so in 6k I would need to repay for all the labor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blake32604 Posted December 1, 2017 Author Share Posted December 1, 2017 Pretty sure 97 and newer SOHC are interference motors. Only 2.2l not interference. Curious if the belt failed or they actually did something clever... I mean dumb. Even if the belt failed, make sure to get it before they do something to it. I can imagine them cutting it after removal to point blame on the part. I assume tensioner fail. What's the mileage recommendation for the timing belt, I thought it was 90k.. Did carmax tell you it had not been done? I got the belt, no cuts or anything but there are absolutely no markings or print on it. Not even indentations. A guy at Subaru told me the cams break on these engines more often than the valves bend. Doesnt makes sense with just #3 no compression. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wasted Potential Posted December 1, 2017 Share Posted December 1, 2017 A valve is art pencil thick and the cam is about anorexic lady wrist thick. Never heard the cam breaking before in this situation but I don't deal much! I know moment of inertia is different, and direction of impact is a player, but I dunno.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JmP6889928 Posted December 1, 2017 Share Posted December 1, 2017 I had a cam break in a Ford 351 Cleveland engine. Chunk fell out right between the first and second cam journals and needless to say, it didn't do much good for those two front connecting rods as they blew their way out the side of the block. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xt2005bonbon Posted December 1, 2017 Share Posted December 1, 2017 Yeah, but on an NA subaru?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infosecdad Posted December 1, 2017 Share Posted December 1, 2017 Did you replace the pulleys with the timing belt? They have a tendency to seize the bearings after a long time. If it broke, then you bent valves at a minimum. As mentioned, Subaru's last non-interference engine was the '96 2.2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apexi Posted December 1, 2017 Share Posted December 1, 2017 My initial thought was the belt must have been cheap or defective, I don't see how else it could break. When you look at the reviews on Amazon, someone else had their evergreen belt break too. *Actually it looks like 2 people did now that I read the reviews again. Evergreen TBK307WPN 06-09 2.5L Subaru Legacy Outback Non-Turbo SOHC EJ25 Timing Belt Kit NPW Water Pump https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00NCJZDN0/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_xxDiAb1DYD4X5 I'm surprised the dealer was willing to install customer supplied parts. People aren't perfect, I know I've made mistakes, but I don't think the dealer made a mistake on the install. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JmP6889928 Posted December 1, 2017 Share Posted December 1, 2017 If it ran correctly when the dealer installed the belt, then they had it on right. I would look closely at idler pulleys or the tensioner and see if there is failure there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wasted Potential Posted December 1, 2017 Share Posted December 1, 2017 I had a cam break in a Ford 351 Cleveland engine. Chunk fell out right between the first and second cam journals and needless to say, it didn't do much good for those two front connecting rods as they blew their way out the side of the block. In that case the least of your worries was bent valves I'm sure:lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
outahere Posted December 3, 2017 Share Posted December 3, 2017 Never heard of Evergreen. Are all the parts in the kit made in China? I have read of at least one OE Subaru tensioner failing a few thousand miles after installation, and destroying the motor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blake32604 Posted December 4, 2017 Author Share Posted December 4, 2017 Did you replace the pulleys with the timing belt? They have a tendency to seize the bearings after a long time. If it broke, then you bent valves at a minimum. As mentioned, Subaru's last non-interference engine was the '96 2.2. Yea, the pulleys were replaced. This is wierd though...everything shows the motor being non-interference. The instructions for the oem kit, and 2 alldata references. Subaru of America told us it was not interference them said they dont have technical capabilities and cant confirm or deny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blake32604 Posted December 4, 2017 Author Share Posted December 4, 2017 Never heard of Evergreen. Are all the parts in the kit made in China? I have read of at least one OE Subaru tensioner failing a few thousand miles after installation, and destroying the motor. Company info is out of California but no mention of where the parts are made. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dishwasher Posted December 4, 2017 Share Posted December 4, 2017 Not sure if this applies to this motor or not, but if the guides were adjusted too close it could have worn the belt out prematurely. Brought to you by Pfizer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
relative4 Posted December 4, 2017 Share Posted December 4, 2017 Perhaps this may help clarify some of the conflicting information. The DOHC 2.5 is interference intake valve to exhaust valve. The SOHC 2.5 is not valve-to-valve interference. ALL 2.5s are interference valve-to-piston. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infosecdad Posted December 4, 2017 Share Posted December 4, 2017 Here is a nice table. Only '96 2.5 DOHC had Valve to valve. All 2.2, 2.5 97+ are piston/valve interference and looks like H6 post 2001 are as well. http://www.scoobyenthusiast.com/subaru-faq/which-subaru-engines-are-interference-what-subaru-engines-are-non-interference/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Gator Posted December 5, 2017 Share Posted December 5, 2017 I got the belt, no cuts or anything but there are absolutely no markings or print on it. Not even indentations. A guy at Subaru told me the cams break on these engines more often than the valves bend. Doesnt makes sense with just #3 no compression. If the belt didn't break...was it still looped around the pulleys, cams, and tensioner when they took the covers off? My guess is the tensioner failed to hold it taught or the tensioner bolt backed out and it fell off. Gates has a specific advisory warning that you must use Loctitie on the tensioner bolt otherwise that can happen. However the Subaru FSM does not specify using Loctite on the tensioner and pulley bolts so most dealership techs don't do it. Nothing like a race track to find the weak points in man and machine. "Good Judgement comes from Experience. Experience comes from Bad Judgement" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apexi Posted December 5, 2017 Share Posted December 5, 2017 Two other reviewers had the same exact thing happen on amazon. I think it was just a cheap belt that broke, simple as that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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