urdrwho Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 Tonight my son called and said the 97 Outback is running hot. It has a 2.2 from a 95 Legacy and has been running fine for three years with that engine. A new radiator was installed 4 year old @ 30,000 miles on it. In 2015 I put new water pump When I arrived I found: The coolant recovery tank had over flowed The upper hose from the radiator to the engine was sucked together There is no sign of coolant on the dip stick Fans run I released the hose clamps a bit on the upper hose so that it would go back to normal and it did. When I squeezed that upper hose I was not feeling or hearing any coolant moving through it. It was like a hose is before the thermo opens. I'm voting for a head gasket but it could be a thermostat that for some reason closed. Any ideas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brighton96 Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 It sounds like you aren't getting flow/have a blockage or air pocket. I don't think it's a HG. I'd drain the system and use a garden hose to back fill the motor and radiator to see if there are any physical blockages and then if you find nothing, refill the system and replace the upper house since I suspect it's structurally compromised. If the upper hose was flatted like that. I'd think maybe the blockage was before it, so thermostat, water pump or radiator? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
urdrwho Posted July 23, 2017 Author Share Posted July 23, 2017 I started thinking about that flat upper hose. If there was a HG leak the car wouldn't have held that flat, the engine would have lost vacuum and the hose could have gone back into position. Could be as simple rad cap or thermo. Since the car is sitting in a parking lot, I'll first try the cap. I don't think the dentist (tenant of building) would appreciate me changing out the thermo and getting any coolant on the parking lot. It sounds like you aren't getting flow/have a blockage or air pocket. I don't think it's a HG. I'd drain the system and use a garden hose to back fill the motor and radiator to see if there are any physical blockages and then if you find nothing, refill the system and replace the upper house since I suspect it's structurally compromised. If the upper hose was flatted like that. I'd think maybe the blockage was before it, so thermostat, water pump or radiator? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brighton96 Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 I don't think it's hurt to let it get close to operating temp with the cap off just to see if there is trapped air. If there's an air pocket in the radiator, being a single core radiator, that would make sense for the symptoms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
urdrwho Posted July 23, 2017 Author Share Posted July 23, 2017 No it won't hurt. When doing a new coolant install I leave the cap off, warm the engine to the point that coolant wants to start coming back out the neck and then apply cap. It is a way for air to work its way out and it has always worked for me. I don't think it's hurt to let it get close to operating temp with the cap off just to see if there is trapped air. If there's an air pocket in the radiator, being a single core radiator, that would make sense for the symptoms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FJuan Posted July 23, 2017 Share Posted July 23, 2017 Simple test for HG, start the car and watch the reservoir tank for air bubbles for at least a few mins while it's warming up. If you see bubbles, take a quick sniff to determini if it smells like exhaust. My wife's balls are delicious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
urdrwho Posted July 23, 2017 Author Share Posted July 23, 2017 Update Started at the cheapest possibility and that was a rad cap. The cap was gummed up with ugly messy stuff. I never use stop leak and not sure where that stuff came from but it could be cheesy stuff from a small HG leak? Time will tell. Installed the cap, it took several attempts to get the rad to take all the coolant. I started car, stopped it to let it cool a bit, put a bit more in and eventually the total that it needed was about a half gallon of pre-mixed coolant. Finally when the temp gauge stopped going 3/4 of the way and I had enough coolant in the rad. I sat in the car with the heater on, waiting for heat. Yeah that wasn't fun on a 92 degree humid day. Finally there was heat, crawled under the car and the lower hose was getting coolant, thermo is open. Started the AC and took the car for a drive and it is fine. Definitely needs a coolant system cleaning! I think the last time a rad cap solved a problem for me was in the early 1970's. I'm still a bit skeptical that the cap was the fix but that flat hose was a sign. This morning when I took the cap off the cool car, the hose had been pulled in a bit overnight and removing the cap created a whoosh and the hose went back 100% into correct shape. New hose will be installed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
urdrwho Posted July 23, 2017 Author Share Posted July 23, 2017 Tried to get a whiff but the coolant was at that point that it would only stay in with an installed cap. Simple test for HG, start the car and watch the reservoir tank for air bubbles for at least a few mins while it's warming up. If you see bubbles, take a quick sniff to determini if it smells like exhaust. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twisty Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 check that thermostat, it could be stuck partially open/closed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
urdrwho Posted July 25, 2017 Author Share Posted July 25, 2017 Even though the thermo is not that old it could be sick. I plan on removing the thermo, the coolant and doing a flush. Replace thermo with a new one. check that thermostat, it could be stuck partially open/closed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setnev Posted July 25, 2017 Share Posted July 25, 2017 The gunk you saw, was it like the consistency of wet shredded paper? My girlfriend's LL Bean kept overheating and every time I'd check the coolant, that is what I saw. Researching the issue, I discovered that a EZ30 blowing the head gasket was rare, so I figured it can't be the HG. Low and behold, after spending a couple hundred dollars on cooling system parts, I rented a block tester from AZ and there was exhaust gasses in the coolant....bad head gasket. Rent a block tester before you start throwing expensive parts at it only to find out what you suspected all along. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doublechaz Posted July 26, 2017 Share Posted July 26, 2017 Stick with dealership for the thermostat. A lot of the parts store ones just aren't up to standard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
urdrwho Posted July 26, 2017 Author Share Posted July 26, 2017 It was more like reddish thick mud. Engine is around 300,000 miles on it and doesn't burn any oil. Oil is disappearing, not leaking (new rear seal, rear engine plate, valve covers, etc) and I believe that there is a possible head leak where the oil is leaking. Ever since installing the engine three years ago I think it has had this small leak. But since it was not going to be driven a lot, it was not a high priority. Then last fall we gave it to my son and he drives a lot. So it could start becoming a much greater problem. Kicking myself in the butt that I didn't have HG's replaced when the engine was sitting on the engine stand. The gunk you saw, was it like the consistency of wet shredded paper? My girlfriend's LL Bean kept overheating and every time I'd check the coolant, that is what I saw. Researching the issue, I discovered that a EZ30 blowing the head gasket was rare, so I figured it can't be the HG. Low and behold, after spending a couple hundred dollars on cooling system parts, I rented a block tester from AZ and there was exhaust gasses in the coolant....bad head gasket. Rent a block tester before you start throwing expensive parts at it only to find out what you suspected all along. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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