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2019 Subaru Ascent Mid-sized SUV - True 3-row vehicle


SBT

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Some additional detail:

From here: http://www.hybrid-car.org/subaru-hybrid.html

 

The SSHEV system places a generator between the Subaru Boxer engine and the transmission. A two-way clutch, the high-performance electric motor and the AWD transfer gearing are all neatly integrated into the transmission case."

 

 

Though one link I found said they determined they couldn't bring production costs down to justify production, which is why it was never brought to market.

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Here:

http://www.hybridbuzz.com/Subaru-B9-SC-Scrambler-Hybrid.htm

 

According to the latest reports, the roll out of the Subaru B9 SC Scrambler Hybrid is being delayed indefinitely. According to Fuji Heavy, owner of Subaru, the car company has not figured out yet how to reduce production costs to the point of being commercially viable.

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I think they're going to try to re-launch a Crosstrek with Hybrid option sometime in the near future. Will be interesting indeed to see if they borrowed any Toyota tech to do that. The biggest thing I see in the Hybrids now is the switch to the Atkinson cycle engine. That obviously, is not, a Boxer, which is core Subaru at this point...

 

I think Mazda was on to something cool with their SkyActive thing. They have a giant capacitor that uses regenerative braking and uses that energy to power interior electronics. It was a cool approach to using it with a true conventional ICE.

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But more likely something like the CrossTrek Hybrid with the motor integrated into the CVT

 

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/Subaru-Impreza-Sport-Hybrid-Transmission.jpg

- Pro amore Dei et patriam et populum -
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I think they're going to try to re-launch a Crosstrek with Hybrid option sometime in the near future. Will be interesting indeed to see if they borrowed any Toyota tech to do that. The biggest thing I see in the Hybrids now is the switch to the Atkinson cycle engine. That obviously, is not, a Boxer, which is core Subaru at this point...

 

I think most modern implementations (at least according to Wikipedia) simulate the asymmetric piston strokes by just holding the intake valve(s) open a little longer so some air gets pushed out, so you could probably add the Atkinson concept to an existing block design fairly easily. I feel like you could take a couple parts from an i-AVLS setup, where you have 2 intake profiles on the cam and a solenoid to lock the lifters into using the lobe with more intake duration while cruising. It'd have to be direct-injected, but you could use Toyota's fancy direct+port injection setup- fire both sets of injectors when you're in Otto cycle mode, and switch to DI-only for Atkinson mode.

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Subaru plans to have a full-electric vehicle in place by CY-2021 and full-model availability of hybrid-electrics by CY-2019.

 

Given the current buying climate, where 30% indicate in surveys that they want hybrid/electric models, but less than 3% buy H-E vehicles, is it really all that critical to get this done before 2025 or so?

- Pro amore Dei et patriam et populum -
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And Toyota's presence is seen in the FA/FB engines and the all new DI versions. It's Toyota's version of AVCS cam sprockets (which is a known issue in the FA and some FB engines), and Toyota's direct injection system that ported directly over from the BRZ/FRS engines
- Pro amore Dei et patriam et populum -
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Subaru plans to have a full-electric vehicle in place by CY-2021 and full-model availability of hybrid-electrics by CY-2019.

 

Given the current buying climate, where 30% indicate in surveys that they want hybrid/electric models, but less than 3% buy H-E vehicles, is it really all that critical to get this done before 2025 or so?

 

I kind of see it as an issue of practicality. It's not practical for everyone to drive a prius. And also to think of the cost to benefit ratio. Current hybrids aren't really saving enough fuel to make up the premium in price you have to pay to get one. I really think for the Ascent, a diesel hybrid would make the most sense but, does subaru even offer a diesel anymore?

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The diesel vs gas debate in the U.S., is driven by taxation economics. Diesel fuel is heavily taxed here in the U.S., while gasoline is not. Exactly the opposite in Europe and the ROW where Subaru markets their 2.0TDs. Subarus with a 2.0TD can get over 600 miles on a 18 gallon tank of fuel.

 

ehsnils has a 2017 Outback in Sweden, can't recall whether that's a TD or just a NA H4, but I know he had (or has) a diesel and has some good feedback on the unit.

- Pro amore Dei et patriam et populum -
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The diesel vs gas debate in the U.S., is driven by taxation economics. Diesel fuel is heavily taxed here in the U.S., while gasoline is not. Exactly the opposite in Europe and the ROW where Subaru markets their 2.0TDs. Subarus with a 2.0TD can get over 600 miles on a 18 gallon tank of fuel.

 

ehsnils has a 2017 Outback in Sweden, can't recall whether that's a TD or just a NA H4, but I know he had (or has) a diesel and has some good feedback on the unit.

 

I have had two diesels with the EE engine, nice for torque but dies down as soon as you pass 3000 rpm. The torque is same as for the H6, and it's starting below 2000 rpm so that's good. And the EE engine works really nice together with the CVT gearbox, but is actually not that fun with a manual gearbox unless you like shifting a lot.

 

But now I have a 2.5i, not the same torque but since the road tax rules changed here it wasn't the same advantage with a diesel anymore. And a lot of talk now about environmental zones in city centers only permitting vehicles conforming to the latest regulations essentially makes it necessary to replace the car on a regular basis with a newer model.

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That's interesting. I think around here, Diesel is around 30-50 cents more per gallon, which is around 10-15% more. I'm pretty sure you can go more than 10-15% farther on that same gallon of diesel, so it actually seems like a better "deal" in the long run.
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Typically, I pay about $.10 more per gallon of diesel here vs 87 octane - post-hurricanes it's about $.20 more. My 03 Dodge QCLB Cummins TD averages 27mpg around town and with its 35 gallon tank will carry me cross-country, from sun-up to sun-down and tow 12,000 lbs. I can't come anywhere close to that with any of my Subarus, but I don't expect that either. Purpose-built machine that beautifully executes its design.

 

My expectations for the Ascent are less, though similar - decent near-30MPG, good hauling and towing capability. Comfortable road cruiser - we like to travel - and the flexibility to add passengers as needed.

Edited by SBT
added octane for comparison
- Pro amore Dei et patriam et populum -
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Diesel around me is still usually a fair bit cheaper than premium.

Diesel is roughly 30-40-cents more per gallon than 87 octane.

93 octane is around 50 cents more.

Murphy (Wal-Mart) has diesel 11 cents cheaper than premium.

 

I just checked at QuickTrip and Diesel is more than Premium by 17 cents, while Mobil has Diesel cheaper than Premium by 31 cents. I guess it varies quite a bit.

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93 Octane here is actually $.20 more per gallon than diesel.

 

It's a huge farming community, so I'm sure that has a lot to do with the lower pricing of diesel - and it's SC, so taxes are lower.

- Pro amore Dei et patriam et populum -
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I think the diesel talk is pretty much moot, Subaru is already phasing out EE diesel in the EU and it isn't coming to the US. European diesel emission are more favorable than gas. The opposite is true in the US, gas emission are more favorable than the diesel emissions.
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Agreed. Subaru has essentially rang the death knell for the boxer diesel

 

And according to Masahiko Inoue, project manager of the new Subaru Impreza, the company has already given up on developing the EE20 any further.

 

subaru-diesel-engine.jpg?width=0&height=0

 

“With diesel it is too difficult to keep the exhaust gas clean,” Inoue said to WhichCar at the Japanese launch of the new Subaru Impreza.

 

“We have already stopped developing it. Diesel is a difficult question for us. Officially, some European dealers or members request us to continue to make it, but our top management direction is to discontinue diesel.

 

“We are discussing this with the European side, the US side and others, discussing what we should do. But in future I think we will not have diesel.”

- Pro amore Dei et patriam et populum -
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My Ex had a TDI VW. The price of diesel during her ownership compare to gas varied throughout the year, but it seem to vary between the price of 87 and 93.

 

We had a Jetta TDI before the Legacy, the price went up in the winter because of heating oil is my understanding.

 

Either way, before they neutered the milage with the new CR engine, we still made out in the long run.

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Well, the EE was a decent engine from driveability perspective, but even here in Europe passenger car diesels looks like a dying breed. For trucks it's a bit different, mostly because they are having a different usage that makes it easier to filter the exhaust.
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First sightings in the wild, reported leaving SIA factory in Indiana:

 

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=259890&stc=1&d=1514133411

 

 

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=259891&stc=1&d=1514133411

 

 

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=259892&stc=1&d=1514133411

 

 

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=259893&stc=1&d=1514133411

 

 

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=259894&stc=1&d=1514133411

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2005 LGT Wagon Limited 6 MT RBP Stage 2 - 248K

2007 B9 Tribeca Limited DGM - 258K

SOLD - 2005 OB Limited 5 MT Silver - 245K

SOLD - 2010 OB 6 MT Silver - 205K

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