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Andrew's DiySB Rebuild


What color combo should I paint my block / heads / valve covers?  

37 members have voted

  1. 1. What color combo should I paint my block / heads / valve covers?

    • everything SILVER
    • everything RED
    • sb RED / heads SILVER / vc's SILVER
    • sb RED / heads SILVER / vc's RED
    • sb SILVER / heads RED / vc's SILVER
    • sb SILVER / heads RED / vc's RED


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To deck/resurface the heads and block I'll be using sandpaper spray-glued to a piece of glass, on top of a thick sheet of MDF. WD-40 will be used for lubricant.

 

Clearly, you plan to take my home-brew rebuild to a new level! Good for you. When you pull the heads and split the block, back things out a little at a time in the reverse-to-torque sequence. It takes a lot of time to correct warpage in a cylinder head with sandpaper!

 

If it is any comfort, the engine I just took apart showed non-measurable warp in both heads and fire decks. You may get lucky too.

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Clearly, you plan to take my home-brew rebuild to a new level! Good for you. When you pull the heads and split the block, back things out a little at a time in the reverse-to-torque sequence. It takes a lot of time to correct warpage in a cylinder head with sandpaper!

The worst part about the Sandpaper?!?! method is that it sounds like something somebody's drunk second-cousin's ex-wife's neighbor did to his Camaro. Doing it slowly and carefully should yield good results. If our heads weren't aluminum I probably wouldn't even consider doing them myself.

 

If it is any comfort, the engine I just took apart showed non-measurable warp in both heads and fire decks. You may get lucky too.

That's very comforting. The best part of my project is that I'm rebuilding a running motor, not one that's already crapped its pants.

Fire decks being the mating surfaces on the block?

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I've heard bad things about King bearings, which would have put us off that track. Good info otherwise.

 

 

Sent from a device using some software.

A couple really enthusiastic anti-ACL threads and King's Bull's Eye Tolerance system are why I decided to use King... as long as my SB is rebuild-able.

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Fire decks being the mating surfaces on the block?

 

Yes, sorry. Not sure that's a widely used term, but common enough amongst the old crowd up here. Firedeck = mating surface on block where the head sits. After you bolt it down to keep it from falling off.

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Will you post some kind of spreadsheet showing how you get to the $38XX figure? Interested in that. Also, I may have given you that link before. This may be helpful to you later.

I used those pics when I unboxed my master gasket set a couple weeks ago. It was really helpful.

 

I'll send you a link to my spreadsheet. It's a little messy right now but you'll probably figure it out after a few minutes.

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Yesterday I made arrangements to borrow my mom's Mini (S) for about the next month in exchange for fixing it's air conditioning. Hopefully it just needs a recharge. Final garage prep begins on Saturday!

 

I've been planning this for what feels like months, and now that it's a couple weeks away from actually starting I'm beginning to second guess some of the things I've already decided. I'm glad I've had the luxury to think everything through while the cars still running. I don't know how anyone could do something like this on short notice or without a written plan.

Edited by StkmltS
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Yesterday I made arrangements to borrow my mom's Mini (S) for about the next month in exchange for fixing it's air conditioning. Hopefully it just needs a recharge. Final garage prep begins on Saturday!

 

I've been planning this for what feels like months, and now that it's a couple weeks away from actually starting I'm beginning to second guess some of the things I've already decided. I'm glad I've had the luxury to think everything through while the cars still running. I don't know how anyone could do something like this on short notice or without a written plan.

 

I admit, I do feel a bit anxious now too knowing that I'll have to go through just about the same thing. But I am pretty sure you'll be fine.

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While this is being discussed, there are a few things that don't seem to be in the master gasket kit 10105AA720. At least the one I got.

 

There are no half moon plugs for the heads. You need 4. Seems like a strange omission but well documented.

 

There are no exhaust gaskets, even for the manifolds to the heads. Need lots.

 

I didn't find any copper washers for the various banjo fittings. You need something like 14 (all one size?). I just bought a bunch in various sizes online and now I'll never be short. And I can pull banjos to my hearts content, knowing I will just chuck the washer and grab a new one. At some point I had pretty much sanded off my fingerprints cleaning up those things for re-use.

 

Precious little of this goes into the short block by the way. 5 O-rings, 3 aluminum washers for the inspection ports, 6(?) special washers for the wet case bolts, and a rear main seal. About $20 if you buy individually.

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Grimmspeed has a nice exhaust gasket kit. Has heads to exhaust manifolds x 2, crosspipe x 2, up to turbo, turbo to down, and a 3 in flat down to catback. No donut gasket if you have 2.5" stock exhaust connection at the catback. Can just get that from Subaru.

 

Be super careful pulling the radiator hoses. Easy to break the old brittle plastic on the radiator. Ask me how I know. Ask me how I like my new all aluminum Koyo radiator. ;) That'll balloon your budget in a heartbeat.

Edited by Dujo
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While this is being discussed, there are a few things that don't seem to be in the master gasket kit 10105AA720. At least the one I got.

 

There are no half moon plugs for the heads. You need 4. Seems like a strange omission but well documented.

 

There are no exhaust gaskets, even for the manifolds to the heads. Need lots.

 

I didn't find any copper washers for the various banjo fittings. You need something like 14 (all one size?). I just bought a bunch in various sizes online and now I'll never be short. And I can pull banjos to my hearts content, knowing I will just chuck the washer and grab a new one. At some point I had pretty much sanded off my fingerprints cleaning up those things for re-use.

 

Precious little of this goes into the short block by the way. 5 O-rings, 3 aluminum washers for the inspection ports, 6(?) special washers for the wet case bolts, and a rear main seal. About $20 if you buy individually.

 

The kit I bought (see link in my previous post) did include the head to manifold exhaust gaskets though. That strange you did not get them.

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The car goes under the knife on Sunday. I should have my [wife approved] schedule finished and posted today/tonight. July 3rd is my (overly ambitious?) target completion date.

 

xt2005bonbon - your rotors may ship today... or tomorrow.

 

Why the crap don't they include an oil pan gasket in the master gasket kit?

 

While this is being discussed, there are a few things that don't seem to be in the master gasket kit 10105AA720. At least the one I got.

 

There are no half moon plugs for the heads. You need 4. Seems like a strange omission but well documented.

 

There are no exhaust gaskets, even for the manifolds to the heads. Need lots.

 

I didn't find any copper washers for the various banjo fittings. You need something like 14 (all one size?). I just bought a bunch in various sizes online and now I'll never be short. And I can pull banjos to my hearts content, knowing I will just chuck the washer and grab a new one. At some point I had pretty much sanded off my fingerprints cleaning up those things for re-use.

 

Precious little of this goes into the short block by the way. 5 O-rings, 3 aluminum washers for the inspection ports, 6(?) special washers for the wet case bolts, and a rear main seal. About $20 if you buy individually.

 

Is there any chance the half-moons are reusable? For some reason I had it in my head that I can just save the ones in there now.

 

I checked my gasket kit against xt2005bonbon's thread and I have all of the same things he got. Apparently not all kits are created equal.

 

I'm probably going to piece-meal the exhaust gaskets, or just order something simple like Dujo pointed out.

 

Grimmspeed has a nice exhaust gasket kit. Has heads to exhaust manifolds x 2, crosspipe x 2, up to turbo, turbo to down, and a 3 in flat down to catback. No donut gasket if you have 2.5" stock exhaust connection at the catback. Can just get that from Subaru.

 

Be super careful pulling the radiator hoses. Easy to break the old brittle plastic on the radiator. Ask me how I know. Ask me how I like my new all aluminum Koyo radiator. ;) That'll balloon your budget in a heartbeat.

 

I'll look in to that gasket kit. It may not make sense though because I already have gaskets for the heads/manifold, the donut, and turbo/DP.

 

I've taken my radiator out a couple times already so the hoses should slide right off. I've noted your concern in my tear-down notes.

Edited by StkmltS
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The car goes under the knife on Sunday. I should have my [wife approved] schedule finished and posted today/tonight. July 3rd is my (overly ambitious?) target completion date.

 

Why the crap don't they include an oil pan gasket in the master gasket kit?

 

I think they want you to just use sealant for the pan (thin bead following the inside of the bolt holes). I use permatex ultra grey, which works very well. Actually it may work too well, if you have to ever take it apart again! You can also use it for other things like case halves, transmission halves, etc.

 

Is there any chance the half-moons are reusable? For some reason I had it in my head that I can just save the ones in there now.

 

They get really brittle over time. If you try to remove them, they will probably crack or crumble. So most likely either don't remove them but rather clean the top surface and re-use, or just buy new ones at the dealer.

BtSsm - Android app/Bluetooth adapter. LV, logging, gauges and more. For 05-14 Legacy (GT, 2.5, 3.0, 3.6), 02-14 WRX, 04-14 STi, 04-14 FXT, 05-09 OBXT
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I think they want you to just use sealant for the pan (thin bead following the inside of the bolt holes). I use permatex ultra grey, which works very well. Actually it may work too well, if you have to ever take it apart again! You can also use it for other things like case halves, transmission halves, etc.

Looks like I get to knock one more think off the list.

 

They get really brittle over time. If you try to remove them, they will probably crack or crumble. So most likely either don't remove them but rather clean the top surface and re-use, or just buy new ones at the dealer.

I've been tossing around the idea to cast my own aluminum ones. You know, 'cause I have so much time on my hands and I need another project. It's not like my wife almost started crying last night when we went over my build schedule.

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xt2005bonbon - your rotors may ship today... or tomorrow.

 

You're the man :cool:. Thanks so much.

 

 

Why the crap don't they include an oil pan gasket in the master gasket kit?

 

When one of my heads got rebuilt on my 05, I asked them to install a killer-b oil pick up. And as heiche said, a sealant was used instead.

 

Is there any chance the half-moons are reusable? For some reason I had it in my head that I can just save the ones in there now.

 

+1 on what heiche said. Same thing in my case, they were reused and did not get removed from the heads. But the engine had 74k at that point. Not sure how they feel/look like at 110k+.

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I'd like some input on my break-in tune. Things are going to start coming off the car this weekend and I'd like to load my post-rebuild tune tomorrow and drive on it for a few miles just to make sure it does what I'm wanting it to do.

 

  1. I'm going to start with CovertRussian's stage-0 safety tune, which eliminates the OL/CL transition delay issue that burns valves. I've been driving on it for the past several months and I know it's compatible with my ECU.
  2. I'm leaving my rescaled MAF table as-is for now, and I'll set it back to the OEM table post-rebuild.
  3. I'm leaving the misfire codes disabled for now, and I'll turn them back on post-rebuild.
  4. I'm leaving the TGV codes disabled for obvious reasons.
  5. Rev Limit Fuel Cut will be set at 4,500/4,200 RPM (on/off). These are just arbitrary levels I'm using while the rings seat. It might not be necessary but I'm doing it to be extra cautious.

 

  • I want to set my boost to the minimum allowable by the wastegate. Is this as simple as changing all cells in the Target Boost tables (A and B) to zero? Or should I change everything in the Initial Wastegate Duty tables to zero? My untrained eye thinks either way would yield the same results.

 

  • Retarding timing... To accomplish this am I correct to subtract a couple degrees from each cell in the Base Timing table? 16.91 becomes 14.91, -3.83 becomes -5.83, and so on. Is two degrees enough or should I retard more? Or maybe this is totally unnecessary?

 

  • Changing my catted UP to a catless UP is part of this project. Post-rebuild, what changes will I make to account for the missing cat?

 

  • Am I missing anything? These things are just for my break-in tune, and I'm not concerned about gas mileage or power.

On a more fun note, my $40 oil pressure sender seems to be working well.

Edited by StkmltS
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I'd like some input on my break-in tune. Things are going to start coming off the car this weekend and I'd like to load my post-rebuild tune tomorrow and drive on it for a few miles just to make sure it does what I'm wanting it to do.

 

  • I want to set my boost to the minimum allowable by the wastegate. Is this as simple as changing all cells in the Target Boost tables (A and B) to zero? Or should I change everything in the Initial Wastegate Duty tables to zero? My untrained eye thinks either way would yield the same results.

 

My break-in tune was my stage 2 etune limited mechanically to wastegate boost (7psi). You can loop the wastegate hose from the compressor to the turbo.

 

That worked fine for 1000 miles.

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If you want to do it electronically, zero the initial WG tables and the target tables. I'm not positive whether the ECU will try to add WGDC if youre not hitting the target. And I would not rely on correction to bring it down from the initial WG tables. Or you can just loop the line. You can just unhook the signal lines from your EBC and put a coupler there to connect them together. I'm assuming it's easier to get to the EBC than the actual turbo nipples. Mine is still looped right past my EBC...

 

I am still on the stock timing map after I smoothed it. I dont think there is much risk leaving your timing alone. Just check for knock.

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For the oil pan, camshafts seats, and block I have always used harley davidson hi performance grey sealant. It is pricey but available at any harley dealer and is a very good sealant. A small tube is enough to do a few engines.

 

I wouldn't be so skeptical about the block, if it is fine now there isn't much reason it won't be afterward, lol. I have built an engine in my garage and while not turbo charged it is still going strong with close to 10k miles on it. I did have the block bored and honed by a machine shop, the heads I cleaned up myself. The engine had a spun rod bearing nothing in the top end was causing problems. The block I built came from a salvage yard with a blown head gasket.

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Thanks for the input guys. I decided to leave the timining as-is and just change the Target Boost and WGDC tables to 0.00. I'm going to load the map tomorrow and drive around for a few miles just to be sure it's correct. It'll be my last pre-rebuild drive... kinda sad and exciting at the same time.

 

I spent much of today cleaning the garage and tomorrow I'll drain the fluids and take off a few easy things like the TMIC and intake. Going over my project schedule has me questioning if I'll actually be able to get this done in a month.

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