Best strategy for replacing a coolant hose

[Kamen]

If anyone knows the name of this little elbow hose, please, let me know so that I can refer to it by name. Anyway, it is pictured here, right behind the oil pan, next to the oil-level pipe:

 

http://i.imgur.com/bhL7plk.jpg

 

It seems like it is leaking from one or both sides, so probably the best next step would be to replace it and use good hose clamps to avoid the leak. The question is: what's the best way to replace it, without having to drain all the coolant. The reason I want to avoid that is because it was replaced recently when the dealership rebuilt the engine and I'd like to avoid the time and expense of needlessly doing it again. I'm thinking something on the line of clamping each side of the old hose, cutting it in half and then quickly replacing each side with the new hose. I'll obviously loose a bit of coolant, and probably spray myself and around the container I'd put underneath, but it's better than doing it all from scratch. Also, if I do that, would I need to go through the air-bleeding procedure outlined in the service manual for when the entire coolant is replaced? Anything else I need to think about?

 

Kamen

[quick4dr]

your going to have to bleed the system no matter what. you can choose to reuse the coolant if you drain it cleanly somehow.

 

id recommend just doing it the regular way. pull lower hose and drain, then replace the coolant elbow.

[Kamen]

I'd just like to know which hose is that. I may need to take more pictures.

 

Kamen

[Rhitter]

I'd just like to know which hose is that. I may need to take more pictures.

 

Kamen

 

Those little elbows are used all over the cooling system. You should be able to find the part number here

http://opposedforces.com/parts/legacy/us_b13/

 

I used that website to find the part number and I ordered a couple of them (but can't find the part number now)

[Kamen]

I can't find it there. Scoured every inch of the Cooling System and looked around everywhere it seemed reasonable (engine). The closest thing are the two pipes at the side of the water pump (807615182 and 807612011), but it's not those - this one is horizontal and not vertical, and there is only one hose there, not two. And I don't remember it being at the front of the engine. I need to go back in there this weekend.

 

Kamen

[birkhoff]

It looks like the elbow hose that connects the RHS port of the water pump to the oil cooler, via the crossover pipe. This one:

 

http://parts.bestbuysubaru.com/p/Subaru_2008_Legacy25L-TURBO-5MT-4WDGT-Limited-Wagon/HOSE/49288176/807611031.html

 

Go to Heuberger's online parts catalog and search under your specific vehicle, but I'm 99% sure the part number will be the same across all the recent 2.5l motors. Except for the coolant leak, nice clean engine you have there!

[Kamen]

I really appreciate it, but it seems like it's none of those, either - you can see on the image above that the hose is horizontal and goes tight by the engine block, and one side goes right into it. I don't see that on any of the diagrams. And I would think I would have noticed a prominent feature, like the oil cooler or the water pump being right next to the hose. Remember, this is behind the oil pan, right where the oil-level pipe enters it. The oil cooler is on the other side, right? And the water pump is at the front of the engine, not behind the oil pan, right?

 

I hate doing this to you, guys; it almost makes me go down and lift the car, but I can't, I'm working; I need to wait until the weekend.

 

Kamen

[birkhoff]

Well I'm totally confused, obviously. In the pic I see the bottom of the timing cover and the oil dipstick tube, which is on the front left side on my engine, as is the water pump. The water pump has a cast body that, I suppose, could be confused with the block, but it is not. OP, are you sure about the orientation? This picture is really from behind the oil pan?

[Kamen]

I don't really know anymore, it has been a year since I took the picture, and I briefly looked at it a few weeks ago when I was changing the oil, so I can't be sure. I'm going to Yellowstone Park with the family in a couple of weeks and I wanted to get this sorted out before that, even though it is not losing much coolant. I think I'll still have time to take care of it by then.

 

Kamen

[Rhitter]

That's the water pump (ish) to coolant crossover pipe hose. I think. I have a similar leak. Although mine might be my water pump

 

From underneath

http://i.imgur.com/C2lXrvw.jpg?1

 

From in front

http://i.imgur.com/QCNKokL.jpg

[Kamen]

It sure looks like it. But it doesn't quite seem to match this diagram:

 

http://static.opposedforces.com/epc_img/366495103502.png

 

On the photos the hose appears to be horizontal and by itself, while on the diagram hoses #9 and #12 go straight up, and there are two of them, side-by-side.

Kamen

[birkhoff]

I think you will find, when you go back in there, that it is at the front of the engine, LHS. The line goes from one side of the water pump (the RHS) over to a similar elbow connecting to the oil cooler. The connection on the pump is on the opposite side to the two lines going upward that you referred to earlier.

 

For some temporary peace of mind, double clamp both sides. Get under there with some slip pliers and move the OEM clamps toward the centre of the elbow, far enough to thread some screw clamps around both ends of the hose. Tighten those down and order the part. This does look like a slow leak.

 

When it comes time to replace the hose, you will need to drain all the coolant. This is very low down in the coolant circuit so if you open it up without draining, you are going to dump pretty much the full load of coolant anyway. Drain from the port on the radiator, or if you are prone to stripping things, crack open the lower rad hose. Catch coolant in a clean pan (like a large dishpan) and then make the repair. You will want to clean up the hard lines with a 3M scrubby (like you wash dishes with). It will be at least slightly corroded in there. With a new hose, and clean connections, the OEM clamps will be fine. Refill with your recovered coolant, go through the air bleed cycle and then top up coolant a day or so later with tap water. You may loose a bit of coolant in the body or splashed around but no matter.

 

Another reason to recycle the coolant is that it has a special conditioner added that can only be purchased through the dealer.

[birkhoff]

Wrong diagram. Look for the 'Oil cooler' breakdown page. You will see the crossover pipe and the two rubber elbows.

 

It sure looks like it. But it doesn't quite seem to match this diagram:

 

http://static.opposedforces.com/epc_img/366495103502.png

 

On the photos the hose appears to be horizontal and by itself, while on the diagram hoses #9 and #12 go straight up, and there are two of them, side-by-side.

Kamen

[Kamen]

Which hose on this diagram:

 

http://parts.bestbuysubaru.com/images/parts/subaru/fullsize/B13_03301039.png

 

H611031? Because it can't be any of the others - one could see the oil filter.

 

Now that I look back, this is the one you pointed out earlier. I guess, distances on this engine are pretty small (and that dotted line could be quite long) and something might have been obstructing the view of the cooler, so it could very well be that one. I just wish they showed on the diagram the connection on the other end, where the leak is, so one could see where it connects. And on the other diagram, that the water pump has another hose coming out of it!

 

Kamen

[Rhitter]

Yep that's the one. H611031

[birkhoff]

Which translates to Subaru #807611031. Don't try to order with the H number at the dealer, although the dealer will have a similar parts breakdown to what you see there if they need to look it up.

 

Notice that the same hose is used at the other side of the hard line, at the oil cooler. As OB2.5XT said, there are lots of little elbows throughout the engine.

[Max Capacity]

You should do what I did when I replaced those hoses 4 years ago. I walked into the dealership, went over to the parts guy's and told them I wanted the small elbow hoses from the water pump and oil cooler and a new crossover pipe. I few minutes later they had gotten all the parts and handed them to me or placed the order. I did have to look up a thing.

 

It's amazing what those guy's can do. Yea you may pay a little more but you get the right part the first time. If not they will fix it.

 

FWIW, if your going to be doing a big project like rebuilding your engine, etc or may be you just want to build a relationship with the dealer. Talk to the parts guy's, see if you'll give you a discount because you'll be spending a lot of money there.

 

I have gotten great payback for the money I have spent at the dealers parts counter. Yea I've spent more then most will, will into the thousands, but when it came time to buy a 2016 Subaru, I happened to mention to the salesman that I'm on a first name basis with the guy's in the parts dept. He walked away for a few minutes and came back with a great offer on the price of the car. He said he went back to the parts guy's asked them if they in fact knew me. He said they told him I was a great long time customer. We got close to $5000 off the price and high trade in, on that car.

 

take the time to get to know those parts guy's.

 

Sorry to ramble on...

 

Oh, BTW you may see a picture of the hoses and crossover pipe in my click here link, I think the pictures start about post #26.

[quick4dr]

I am a parts guy! Its true we take care of our good customers, from parts discounts to sales haggeling, even some muscle in the service department. Keep our butcher techs away from good clients... that kind of thing

[Max Capacity]

I am a parts guy! Its true we take care of our good customers, from parts discounts to sales haggeling, even some muscle in the service department. Keep our butcher techs away from good clients... that kind of thing

 

There's someone above that may need your help

 

To bad he's 2/3rd's the way across the country...

[Kamen]

I appreciate your advise, but my situation is rather complicated. I have one Subaru dealership that's 3 miles from home, and another that is ~13 miles away. Add to that a small private company that used to reside in the dealership, and who sells discounted OEM parts to members of a local online forum. They helped me a lot when sourcing the parts for the engine rebuild, but now they've moved out, have different people and have proven not to be a reliable source.

 

I took the Outback to the farther dealership when its engine needed rebuilding a couple of years ago (couldn't do it myself for various reasons) because I was told by the natives that the closer one was so-so, but the farther one was great. So much for greatness: they did >$5000 worth of work and didn't replace some $5 items that needed it; but most importantly, when I talked to them about it, just barely out of their warranty, they said "o-o-o-o, too bad, tsk-tsk!"

 

Anyway, outside of the big Outback failures (I also have/had two Legacies and a WRX) I had always done all my work myself, and before moving here, I was in a place where the closest Subaru dealership was 50 miles away. So, I got me a "parts guy" who was a couple of thousand miles away but would sell me parts for up to 25% off list - yes, the friendly Washington State Subaru dealers. I still use him for most of my genuine Subaru parts. I just don't have enough to invest in a local parts guy (and which of the two would that be?). Add to that the fact that I have never bought a new car, nor do I intend to, and it's getting difficult to "grow" myself a strong local relationship.

 

Having said that, on Tuesday I picked up a gallon of Supercoolant ($22) from the closer one, along with the little hose (it's more expensive but I don't need other parts now to offset shipping costs, and I wanted it before the weekend), and that guy was very friendly (in a good way, not the fake politeness of most sales people), so I'll probably do that again in the future.

 

Kamen

[Max Capacity]

Sorry to forget to mention you don't need to use their coolant. I've been running Peak Global or Prestone coolant for many years. I get it at K Mart or Wal Mart.

[Shadow_419]

I switched to Peak Global when I replaced my turbo coolant lines. Needed to replace the coolant anyway. I picked it up at Walgreens pharmacy. $13 for a 50/50 gallon. You use about 1.5 gallons refilling.

[Kamen]

Sorry to forget to mention you don't need to use their coolant. I've been running Peak Global or Prestone coolant for many years. I get it at K Mart or Wal Mart.

 

I fully realize that, and I do use Prestone in my other Subarus, but the Supercoolant is supposed to have some advantages, plus the engine is already full of fresh Supercoolant, so I thought I'd stay with it. I don't plan to keep it in there forever; I'll still replace it periodically, but maybe just not as often.

 

Kamen

[Kamen]

That was the correct hose, thank you very much. Here is a picture of the location:

 

http://i.imgur.com/756VjOF.jpg

 

I replaced the hose easily, recovered all coolant in clean containers, and only had to add less than a pint.

 

The trouble though: that is not the only source of the leak!

 

First, the other end of the hose goes to an outlet off of the water pump that is not shown on any of the diagrams in the service manual. It is on the opposite side of the two outlets that are shown on the diagram and you can see it on this picture:

http://i.imgur.com/NB2sxM1.jpg

What troubles me is that on the service report it clearly states that the water pump was replaced during the engine rebuild and that was only 12K miles ago! Does it look to you like this has only 12K on it? Here is a close-up:

http://i.imgur.com/dNQHtUS.jpg

That's either the old water pump or that Subaru Supercoolant is more corrosive than Flint water! Anyway, I cleaned it up as much as I could (I hate those super-cramped spaces!) and put the new hose on it:

http://i.imgur.com/Dp6Hnrz.jpg

Then I started the air-bleeding procedure and after only one heat cycle, it is apparent that the leak is elsewhere (there might have originally been some around the hose, too, but that is a moot point since there aren't any now):

http://i.imgur.com/etjgWUJ.jpg

It seems like it is coming from between the water pump body and the block. I haven't replaced the water pump on the EJ255, and I don't actually remember how it was on the EJ22, but is that likely? Does it use a gasket or sealant at that spot?

Man, I'm so angry! I have the most-reputable Subaru dealership in the area do the engine rebuild, I gave them the carte blanche to do what it takes to get it right, I approved any additional work they suggested (valve buckets, water pump) and now it's leaking! Do I have to do all my work? I'm getting old for this rubbish. And I hate fluid leaks!

Kamen

[Kamen]

The more I look at it, the more it seems to me that this area (where the hose connects) is not part of the water pump. And that I won't really know where exactly the leak is coming from until I take the whole thing apart...

Kamen