need bb Posted March 14, 2016 Share Posted March 14, 2016 Any updates? I was thinking of trying this on my LGT, but wanted to hear some feedback first. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fahr_side Posted March 15, 2016 Author Share Posted March 15, 2016 Here to help if you want to get into this. Sent from a device using some software. Obligatory '[URL="http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/2008-gh8-238668.html?t=238668"]build thread[/URL]' Increased capacity to 2.7 liters, still turbo, but no longer need spark plugs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
need bb Posted April 14, 2016 Share Posted April 14, 2016 It looks like the 05's have a less detailed table Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fahr_side Posted April 14, 2016 Author Share Posted April 14, 2016 Yes, less resolution. I look at the GRB tables and feel just as inadequate Sent from a device using some software. Obligatory '[URL="http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/2008-gh8-238668.html?t=238668"]build thread[/URL]' Increased capacity to 2.7 liters, still turbo, but no longer need spark plugs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
need bb Posted April 14, 2016 Share Posted April 14, 2016 Is it even worth modifying the table given I don't spend much time below 2K except when traffic? I think scaling the values from every 200 RPMs to 400 RPMs might have negative implications. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fahr_side Posted April 15, 2016 Author Share Posted April 15, 2016 The stock table is pretty smooth. Sent from a device using some software. Obligatory '[URL="http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/2008-gh8-238668.html?t=238668"]build thread[/URL]' Increased capacity to 2.7 liters, still turbo, but no longer need spark plugs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fahr_side Posted May 10, 2016 Author Share Posted May 10, 2016 Update. So far I'd been working on the EL comp tables on my own car by applying the corrections equally to both 'cruise' and 'non-cruise' tables, even though one thing never sat right in my mind. If 'non-cruise' condition is generally held to mean the car is fueling in open-loop, why is there a table for EL comp, which is used in calculating closed loop fueling, labeled 'non-cruise'? I've been working on both tables together since winter, where I normally drive around with the a/c off unless it's raining. As soon as I started running the a/c again I noticed I had the old lumpiness back and started logging fuel trims again to see what was up. Sure enough, a few cells in the EL comp table needed work again but now instead of changing both tables I'm changing the 'non-cruise' table only. Sure enough, that is getting the results I want without having to touch the 'cruise' table, so changes applied to help things when the a/c is on don't seem to hurt anything when the a/c is off. Obligatory '[URL="http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/2008-gh8-238668.html?t=238668"]build thread[/URL]' Increased capacity to 2.7 liters, still turbo, but no longer need spark plugs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perscitus Posted June 1, 2016 Share Posted June 1, 2016 fahr_side - thanks for the great write up and guide on the first page! Are you saying you've found two EL comp tables and that we should expect most recent-gen Subaru's to have both? I wonder how I can find the second one in my ROM (ScoobyROM? td_d or dschultz's help?) Airboy's excellent spreadsheet is one way to go about this, another is to use a JAVA based tool developed with this one and many other RR tools at its core. http://www.romraider.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=32&t=10481 https://github.com/vimsh/mafscaling/wiki Its fully configurable, great at digesting multiple or large log (hundreds of thousands of rows of data). Works great in conjunction with RR and it takes a lot of the manual steps out of the equation. Thus far I've used it for MAF rescaling, CL/OL adjustments, Load Comp tweaking, MAF IAT Comp tweaking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fahr_side Posted June 1, 2016 Author Share Posted June 1, 2016 Thanks. Yes, mine and many other 32bit ROMs have two tables. Like I said, it makes no sense that they are labelled cruise and non-cruise when by definition non-cruise is open-loop, which does no corrections to fuel trims. Sent from a device using some software. Obligatory '[URL="http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/2008-gh8-238668.html?t=238668"]build thread[/URL]' Increased capacity to 2.7 liters, still turbo, but no longer need spark plugs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solidxsnake Posted June 3, 2016 Share Posted June 3, 2016 Thanks. Yes, mine and many other 32bit ROMs have two tables. Like I said, it makes no sense that they are labelled cruise and non-cruise when by definition non-cruise is open-loop, which does no corrections to fuel trims. Sent from a device using some software. From my understanding, "cruise" is TGVs closed, and "non-cruise" is TGVs open. You're not necessarily in open-loop if the TGVs are open. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fahr_side Posted June 4, 2016 Author Share Posted June 4, 2016 From my understanding, "cruise" is TGVs closed, and "non-cruise" is TGVs open. You're not necessarily in open-loop if the TGVs are open. That's an interesting idea. If that's the case then we should also filter data collected by TGV position and apply corrections accordingly. Those with deleted TGVs should have the same compensations in both cruise and non-cruise tables. Obligatory '[URL="http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/2008-gh8-238668.html?t=238668"]build thread[/URL]' Increased capacity to 2.7 liters, still turbo, but no longer need spark plugs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flinkly Posted June 4, 2016 Share Posted June 4, 2016 Yeah, this cruise/non cruise talk has piqued my interest. About to tgv delete too. * Build Thread * 26.53 MPG - 12 month Average * Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solidxsnake Posted June 4, 2016 Share Posted June 4, 2016 That's an interesting idea. If that's the case then we should also filter data collected by TGV position and apply corrections accordingly. Those with deleted TGVs should have the same compensations in both cruise and non-cruise tables. That's how the tables translate if you look at the maps as described by COBB in AccessTuner. The tables labeled "Cruise" in Tactrix definitions are labeled "(TGV Open)" in AccessTuner. Makes sense if you look at the maps too (e.g. the AVCS maps, the ignition maps, etc). Also, operation of the TGVs in '07+ cars explains the naming: http://i32.tinypic.com/5dq9n9.jpg Under cruise (low throttle/loads), the TGVs remain closed, regardless of engine speed/temperature, etc., in order to aid in more complete combustion. A little more throttle will open the TGVs. There aren't any tables to adjust how the TGVs operate (no one, including COBB, has reverse-engineered this as far as I know), so unfortunately we're stuck with physically deleting them. Sorry if everyone already knew this... just want to make sure that people are aware that 2007+, the TGVs don't open at first throttle press and stay open until the next start like the '05-'06 MY. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fahr_side Posted June 4, 2016 Author Share Posted June 4, 2016 Good information, thanks! I'm also hoping someone will define the TGV tables in Ecuflash or RR because I'd like to re-purpose those motors to drive a butterfly valve for an active muffler idea I have rattling around the back of my brain. It is fully defined in (the otherwise shitty) Subaruedit for the DIT cars. They also name everything TGV Open / Closed, though I don't see an EL comp table in any of the WRX or FXT ROMs I have here. Could be they're just not defined, could be the DIT ECUs just have different logic. I haven't played with ATR in ages, but I kind of remember it also used the cruise / non-cruise labels in the version I had. Obligatory '[URL="http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/2008-gh8-238668.html?t=238668"]build thread[/URL]' Increased capacity to 2.7 liters, still turbo, but no longer need spark plugs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cBax Posted June 4, 2016 Share Posted June 4, 2016 Can you force a different AFR with each table? Or will fuel trims adjust and just bring it back? '05 Outback XT www.facebook.com/baxleysspeedshop www.baxleysspeedshop.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flinkly Posted June 4, 2016 Share Posted June 4, 2016 Can you force a different AFR with each table? Or will fuel trims adjust and just bring it back? With these tables, can't change afr as it'll just compensate to get to 14.7. For example, i tuned mine to give me -2 learning in all ranges. The big thing is that your compensations aren't running all over from -7 to +7 as you move through rpm and load, causing a little roughness as it tries to keep up with current conditions. But you could force open loop and set afr to something else if you desire different afr... * Build Thread * 26.53 MPG - 12 month Average * Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cBax Posted June 6, 2016 Share Posted June 6, 2016 thanks! I was just curious. I do actually run my mazda 3 in full time open loop. Been that way for over a year and gets mid 30s mpg. A custom target would be sweet though. Never seems to be really possible with any of the stock ecus Ive tuned. '05 Outback XT www.facebook.com/baxleysspeedshop www.baxleysspeedshop.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solidxsnake Posted June 6, 2016 Share Posted June 6, 2016 thanks! I was just curious. I do actually run my mazda 3 in full time open loop. Been that way for over a year and gets mid 30s mpg. A custom target would be sweet though. Never seems to be really possible with any of the stock ecus Ive tuned. You can set custom targets in all the Subaru ROMs I've seen... There's just compensations applied to it afterwards. Look for the Primary Fueling table (3D table that sets target AFR vs RPM and calculated load). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perscitus Posted June 6, 2016 Share Posted June 6, 2016 td_d confirmed that unlike EJ25s and potentially other H4s, the recent/current-gen H6s (3.0R, 3.6R) only have one EL Comp (Load Comp MP) table. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fahr_side Posted June 7, 2016 Author Share Posted June 7, 2016 That's what is defined and if he says the other table isn't there I wouldn't doubt him. Sent from a device using some software. Obligatory '[URL="http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/2008-gh8-238668.html?t=238668"]build thread[/URL]' Increased capacity to 2.7 liters, still turbo, but no longer need spark plugs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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