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Resurrect Subie Wan Kenobi


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:confused:

 

 

 

HP = Torque {lb-ft} * RPM / 5252

 

 

It's a learning curve thing.

 

But that being said about the oem block okay to handle those targets. It would be less prone to pop again wouldn't it? I know it's a lot of money but I'm in the block already and might as well beef it up a little right? I'm just a little finicky about oem reliability. I'll continue to read.

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I understand what you're saying. Just get a tune. A good tuner will not tune a steet car like a race car. Race fuel is different than pump gas. Your 18g will only put out so muchboost and the car will only make so much power. It's not going to blow up like slapping a GT35R on a stock block and running max boost would.

 

 

I needed that. I need to be cuddled during this ha

Edited by keenster
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And before I forget, buy a new oil cooler. Don't try to clean yours. They're so cheap relatively speaking that it's a no brainer.

 

Could you have lucked out? Possibly. Only time will tell. Personally, I'd bite the bullet now and get the engine out, heads off and inspected by a Subaru shop (valve wear and shim adjustment). A new OEM block will go a long way in your future build. You can sell the old one for a few hundred as well to someone who is looking to build a block up.

 

The OEM block is so cheap from Subaru, it doesn't make sense to rebuild it from parts unless you are cash-strapped and have machinery to bore out the old block (if needed). Labor alone will put you near the cost of a new shortblock.

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Okay after doing some research for a few days I've come to a target "goal".

 

So I guess my "target" hp would be anywhere from 300-350. From reading I feel the car will handle it and so will the tranny with supporting mods. Can a tuner tune more torque then just pushing the car to what it's capable for? Like maybe not so much hp and more torque?

 

I'm pretty sure I need a rebuilt low end and it's not just a blown turbo. I had chunks of flake in the oil pan so I have to crack it open anyways. So brings my next thing up, which I might take some heat on.

 

I think at those goals, forged Pistons and new connecting rods and studs are never a bad idea. Basically I want a built engine tuned down. Is that a bad idea or the stupidest thing I've said yet? Or is having a good running block capable of more power dumbed down not viable? I am going to edit my parts list on the OP.

 

Not necessarily. Boxkita has a built motor that's capable of 500+, but he had JohnJohn cut it off at 335ish. (whp/wtq) He's not dumb.

 

The OEM block will work with an 18g

 

This. It should be just fine, as long as you get a good tune and don't drive like an idiot. These are machines, sure, but, they're not bulletproof, or idiot-proof; they must be driven with respect.

 

 

A built engine "tuned down" is just a waste of money.

 

 

It all depends on the end use; for street --absolutely a waste, period. For mild/weekend autox/track use, probably overkill.

 

My personal opinion is that studs are not needed until you're well into the built engine territory. Experiential evidence on the forum has a few 500 hp motors on the factory bolts.

 

That being said, my brother has an 18g, OEM bottom end, and ARP studs. It has been fine for 2 years and sees occasional "fun".

 

Think about how often Subarus blow HGs -- Wouldn't you want the $200 peace of mind? Remember, when doing an engine rebuild (to the tune of many thousands), another couple hundred becomes chump change. .

 

But that being said about the oem block okay to handle those targets. It would be less prone to pop again wouldn't it? I know it's a lot of money but I'm in the block already and might as well beef it up a little right? I'm just a little finicky about oem reliability. I'll continue to read.

 

If you're gonna go with a forged build you're better off using brand new OEM case halves; otherwise, you're machining off cylinder meat to fit whatever size pistons, which, ultimately, will limit the boost (and power!) you will be able to sustain with that motor. Unless you're just gonna go all-out sleeved, but again, money.

 

See some of the big build threads here -- It's just not really worth the hassle. There's no guarantee that it will last long enough to make it worth the investment in both time and money, for what really amounts to a small bump in performance. There's no greater reliability or promise of durability over stock, since there's so much variation in usage, as well as quality in workmanship between block builders.

 

I needed that. I need to be cuddled during this ha

 

I think you meant coddled, but, we're happy to help you feel the love. :wub:

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And before I forget, buy a new oil cooler. Don't try to clean yours. They're so cheap relatively speaking that it's a no brainer.

 

 

Yup! Anything that carries oil is worthwhile to replace, or, if possible, clean (like the OCVs, although, if they haven't been replaced in that last 75k, then it's time.) Personally, I chose to replace them. Again, what's another $180?

 

The OEM block is so cheap from Subaru, it doesn't make sense to rebuild it from parts unless you are cash-strapped and have machinery to bore out the old block (if needed). Labor alone will put you near the cost of a new shortblock.

 

There's no way one can ever beat OEM build, quality and price with a forged motor. It just won't happen.

 

As a general rule, if dollars are being counted, then you don't need a forged motor.

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Flatirontuning has the ej257 for the same price? Any rejections on that? You guys are awesome by the way. I appreciate all the help. I might go back to oem thanks to you guys. http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/14/10/21/ce66d74414c06f579c8aaa428ae9c3e8.jpg

 

Pulled it straight out without unbolting anything

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If it ran well and has good compression and passes leakdown, it will work. Does it have a warranty? The EJ255 in the 2005-2006 cars and EJ257 are the same engine sans piston P/N.

 

If you were getting a new OEM shortblock, you'd be buying a EJ257 btw.

 

Subaru has a 12 month / 12,000 miles warranty on their parts. I don't know how they would substantiate it given that unless it's a documented install by a dealer it is near impossible for them to determine if it was correctly installed without a thorough engineering investigation (not cost effective).

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I have the 06 but I thought the ej257 was the STI block?

Says warranty included but not if its going in a car not what's it's suppose to go in for. They even have the STI block with the heat treated crank for the same price too?!

P/N? Part number?

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You need PN 10103AC0X0, where X = 3, 4, or 5. Doesn't really matter, all are same, with difference of crank. Nitrided, heat treated versions; neither will have any difference that you'll be able to tell.

 

I personally have the 030, which is a new 255. Came with the black nitrided crank. :wub:

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Also, while Flatirons is another great Colorado Subaru dealership (I bought my Cobb DP from them!), they don't have the volume pricing discount that Heuberger does.

 

Flatirons is $18something, while Heuberger is $1645. For that same $18something at Flatirons, you could get the shortblock, plus the gasket kit for your year car. (O5's PN gasket kit ends 0720. .) at Heuberger's. Should be just under $2100 shipped to your door.

Edited by MrTris
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Basically better fatigue life, impact resistance, wear improvement. Maybe less than a percent on some engines and others more, but we're talking about an industry where a single percent is huge.

 

Where the HP:$$ ratio sucks more, and hundreds of dollars are equivalent to pennies!

 

For even a motorsports, application, though, I can't see a situation where a heat-treated crank vs a nitrided crank would make a difference. Heck, the only reason I say go nitrided is because it's hella cool lookin'! (for the small amount of time you get to see it before you put the pickup and oil pan on) :lol:

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Here's where nitriding is really noticeable.

 

TL;DR. Can you broadstroke it for me?

 

Basically better fatigue life, impact resistance, wear improvement. Maybe less than a percent on some engines and others more, but we're talking about an industry where a single percent is huge.

 

for a street car, because bling

for a race car, because high rpm for long time

for a endurance/rally race car, because more time between rebuilds

 

For what its worth, mine has neither of these bragging rights. Cosworth offers nitriding in its 9k rpm blocks. If I was going to build out another block, for racing, I'd probably invest in Swaintech's coating processes first.

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A built engine "tuned down" is just a waste of money.

 

Based on what?

 

A tuned down built motor runs more miles than a built motor running at the very end of its range. Keep in mind, when racing (drag racing is not really racing - motor only has to last 10 seconds), the longer the motor lasts the more racing you can do and less fixing. Secondly, in racing turbo motors, its the area under the curve not the height of the triangle that matters.

 

In my case, I could have spent another 5-15k and had a 450atq 9k motor that had huge power throughout the range. However, at the paltry 335atq that I have, I'm already faster than 90% of my competition. The remaining 10% are independently wealthy.

 

My motor made 250atq at 2k. 335 from 2800 to 7500. I set the rev limiter to 6800, cause otherwise I'd drive at 7500 all the time. As it is, I drive at 4-5k all the time and regularly shift at 6500.

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This goes back to the same thing where STi owners (twats) claim they've got 500+hp blah, blah, blah, and the biggest question no one asks is, ". . . for how long?"

 

Sure, you can squeeze 350+awhp out of a "built" motor. Honestly, though, it won't last you long. And even if it does, your tranny won't handle it for much longer, either.

 

I've ridden in Boxkita's wagon; for the "paltry" 335hp he makes with that setup, I can only imagine what more feels like. I also question the dyno and/or tuner that says certain vehicles make more than that. I also question anyone who says, "I need at least 300 hp for my daily driver". They might as well just show me the milk on their tongue.

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Truthfully who cares what other people wanna do with there car. If I spoke my mind everytime I saw a car or a build that I felt was "retarded" then I proly would lose all sleep and be spouting off on this forum all day. Give facts based on experience and reccomend options but if someone wants to have 800hp lgt DD then more power to them. And if they fail to realize how difficult that is then it's there fault. My builder has a 2001 s4 with a custom gt35 on it that is around 700hp and he drives it on the street from time to time and it's not an issue . Sure he might break a driveshaft or something but that's the price u pay for high hp. Have realistic goals thAt are achievable and never let anyone deter you.
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Really interested to see where this build goes. Lots of great advice being tossed around from MrTris and Boxkita and hobo2701 all who have very respectable builds. Personally I agree with you about enjoying the twisty roads and not so much the fast straight line freeway stuff. I am currently in the process of tuning for "Stage 2" and already and happy with my power levels. The next things I will be looking at are larger sways, poly bushings, and a ton more suspension components and then also a Brembo kit as stopping is important as well. Really curious to see how this build turns out and what the engine is capable of and what you end up tuning it for.

2005 Vader Wagon

Material Tests on Ringland Failure Piston

I should have held off and purchased a wagon instead of the spec.B
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Really interested to see where this build goes. Lots of great advice being tossed around from MrTris and Boxkita and hobo2701 all who have very respectable builds. Personally I agree with you about enjoying the twisty roads and not so much the fast straight line freeway stuff. I am currently in the process of tuning for "Stage 2" and already and happy with my power levels. The next things I will be looking at are larger sways, poly bushings, and a ton more suspension components and then also a Brembo kit as stopping is important as well. Really curious to see how this build turns out and what the engine is capable of and what you end up tuning it for.

 

It's easy to want more :D. More power, more handling, more stopping power. It's never ending.

 

Although for brakes Brembo's are mostly bling. Boxita tracked his OEM brakes and only had issues because he needed better cooling.

 

Nothing wrong with bling though...

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