TSiWRX

Penguin, was this you?

 

 

https://www.facebook.com/BlackfoxIRT/photos/a.216612628762816.1073741829.184454238645322/462882550802488/?type=3&permPage=1

 

 

 

 

 

One of the things I've seen over and over and over again at matches and frankly am growing quite tired of it is the issue of malfunctions in pistols and carbines.

 

 

The last match I attended (you all may have seen the posts), I witnessed numerous malfunctions occur that were all platform related (not ammunition and not feed source).

 

 

Stovepipes, failure to extract, failure to eject, fail to feed, bolt override, and double feeds were all issues noted in the last match I attended.

This match required less than 50rds rifle and less than 50rds pistol to run it clean.

100 of each if youre a poor shooter.

 

 

 

Ladies, gents, and all others... if your Carbine or Pistol cannot chew through 100rds of quality ammunition with no hiccups, then you need to cease and desist all match shooting and attend a basics in firearm care course (NRA beginner level) and a Level 1 Carbine & Pistol course (local instructional ranges).

 

 

 

 

I find it highly suspicious that you'd post up a rant just hours before this one!

 

Ultimately I don’t care if someone wants to waste their money, let them. If my $2000 LWRC makes it to 20k rounds and i’m still on barrel, BCG and trigger #1 and they’re on barrel #3, BCG #2 or 3, and trigger number 2, they’ve invested more money and time in to their rifle than me, so who’s the smarter owner?

 

Though I will probably not shoot this rifle to 20k rounds, that’s serious usage and money on ammo Only routine maintenance LWRC recommends between 0-20k is replacing the piston at 10k rounds and it’s not a must.

 

 

I think you'll get there fast enough. My goal for the new beater last year was 5K rounds, and I only missed it by about 500 or so because I got injured and stopped going to the range to practice: most of that was just classes, and I didn't even take that many classes, compared to some of the guys I know.

 

 

Even not training nearly as much, my original beater managed 4K rounds over the span of a little over a year.

 

 

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My brief take on this is that you’re either willing to pay for engineering knowledge, skilled assembly and inspection, and product testing or you’re not. You’re either a fully qualified person to do all those things yourself, or more than likely you’re not.

 

 

Very well said.

 

 

The real problem is a combination of choice-supportive bias and regret aversion bias.

 

 

 

 

The extra intellectual effort, and hands on labor for good assembly and QC costs money. There’s no real magic here, we’re talking about steel, aluminum, and plastics for the most part. For some reason there is a subset of morons in the firearms community who refuse to comprehend that parts are not just parts in every case. These stupid assholes believe that the gun should basically be sold for the cost of raw materials. You’ll find these retards buying cheap parts, assembling AR’s incorrectly, and then spending lots of time trying to figure out why their shit doesn’t work. I have zero patience or use for them, whether I see them online or worse at the range.

 

 

The worst thing, though, is not like the knowledge isn't out there or is somehow difficult to access.

 

 

Anyone can sit down and spend the hour to watch the late Pat Roger's final lecture and gain excellent basic, fundamental knowledge from that wonderful presentation. For free.

 

 

 

Spend the $15 to $25 on Panteao's website or the like and stream, for example, Dean Caputo's AR15 Armorer's Bench video, and they'll be able to confidently take apart and put back together their weapon.

 

 

 

That same person can then step up to the few hours of P&S Modcasts and really nerd-out - delving deeper than any hobbyist-level shooter/enthusiast would ever truly need. Again, this is totally for free.

 

 

 

Finally, instead of a blasting off case of .223 half-drunk at their third-inbred-cousin's back-yard, they could take that same money - and the time it took to drink that alcohol and recover from the hangover - and easily have the necessary funds to attend a great open-enrollment "armorer's class" that will give them virtually all the knowledge that they'd need, short of the certificate.

there's a lot of companies that don't manufacture anything which I tend to avoid.

 

Noveske doesn't manufacture much in house, I think the only things they actually manufacture are their lower receivers and rails. Uppers are VLTOR, Barrels are Pacnor (rifled exclusively to their specs), BCG's are Rubber city Armory, Geissele Charging Handle, Geissele and ALG Triggers, Magpul Furniture (that I'm fine with, after my experience with LWRC's stock, stick to the experts on the furniture) but that doesn't bother me so much because they use the highest quality parts they could find to put together a rifle that delivers a great shooting experience.

 

That's what I look for now, a rifle that's reliable AND has a good shooting experience. My Colt was reliable, but I didn't like shooting it.

 

Whether a vendor is a "manufacturer" really doesn't mean that much to me, as long as the parts they use are quality components *_and_* their assemblers/builders actually know what they are doing, because those two factors are really what makes the difference. Take Sons of Liberty Gun Works, for-instance. There's a reason why they use the parts they use in their guns and why they take the time and energy to build the guns they way they do. Same with Noveske, as you cited. We all remember the not-long-ago "walk through video" that a lesser make made of their shop floor, which got dissected and bashed by the online AR community for the lackadaisical manner in which their assemblers Bubba'ed together the guns that were heading out of their warehouse.

 

The biggest problems with the big parts like the lower and upper is not their materials - rather, it's whether or not they are in-spec. And that's not so much in terms of the forging, but rather, in the final machining/milling. Most actually agree that the typical 7075-T6 forgings are essentially the same, and it's whether the parts finished to - or even beyond to a more exacting standard than - spec'ed tolerance that's the problem: think inability of fire-control components to properly align/install, problematic grip screw threading, take-down pin alignment issues, or magwell tolerances, which are the common complaints on the "lesser" lowers, such as Andersons.

 

And this is as much a manufacturing issue as it is a QC/QA issue. As Chad Mercer and Tom Victa noted openly on a past P&S ModCast, this is where they can't fathom how Anderson and the like are able to push out lowers and small parts at the price-point they're at...because having been inside that part of the industry intimately (with big-name companies such as LWRC and FN), they know the costs involved to insure the level of QC/QA necessary, and they can't fathom how the discount companies are able to have prices so low, without cutting some very harsh corners.

 

And this cost extends to that subjective "feel" you cited, too.

 

A functional, reliable, and durable weapon is what the "MilSpec" TDP is after.

 

It's the finer art of tuning the gas system, managing the recoil buffer assembly, matching the gun with a for-purpose muzzle device, and going after that extra bit of durability/reliability (like penguin so nicely explained of the KAC's proprietary bolt assembly, for-instance) and/or accuracy/precision (by, for example, managing barrel harmonics - look at the BCM's ELW profile barrel [and I get it, no, it's not a precision barrel, by-far, but it is very good for what it actually is), of the gun being spec'ed with parts that make sense - that makes for these "more enjoyable" guns.

 

 

But that takes engineers sitting behind computers. It takes time and experience (listen to how passionate and knowledgeable guys like Mike Mihalski are, when they discuss the finer points of the AR as a mechanical system). It takes a willingness to go that extra mile in QA/QC - and all of that costs money.

 

I think people take things too far when they "snob-free" their AR, or when they narrowly look at the field as either "duty grade" or not.

 

I think that in the vast majority of cases, "hobby-grade" Anderson, PSA, Aero, or what have you guns will work just fine - and that they will be every bit as durable, reliable, and accurate as any "duty-grade" gun. But that said, the chances that something may be awry on the lower-tier components or completes: be it something instantaneously no-go such as components being out-of-spec or something that comes over time - durability/reliability related - with wear and tear also increases, and depending on one's end-purpose for that weapon, this may be a no-go criteria.

Theoretically that can happen with any brand lower, but when you’re charging $40 for a lower receiver I can’t imagine it being made with quality metals. Combine that with cheap BCG’s and ammo it’s a recipe for disaster. Start with a Spike’s lower at the minimum, or splurge more and get an assembled lower from BCM or LWRC and build from there.

 

 

There aren't that many places doing the forgings. Unless you're going with one of the billets or the exotic materials (and both become a whole different ballgame altogether), that's not really the issue.

 

 

The issues comes in with QA/QC.

 

 

 

Dimensional issues are one thing that is readily apparent here. As are small parts that fall below (or are otherwise outside of) the "MilSpec" TDP. It then becomes an issue of whether the company that does the final work actually goes to the trouble of QA/QC, and how in-depth they pursue such assurances and testing. There's a reason why those little springs and detents in a Colt or other MilSpec LPK are the colors that they are, and it's not because of prettiness, but because they are a certain metal that's been heat and chemical treated in a certain way so as to insure that they'll meet or exceed a certain usage and life cycle, and also so that they won't wear a hole in the parts that they are designed to capture (provided that part is, by itself, also correctly made). There's a reason why when you open 10 Aero bolts from their complete BCGs that some will have an insert or a doughnut and others won't, versus when you look at the BCM, they'll all contain the insert and ship with the doughnut separate.

 

 

 

This is where the cost differences come in, outside of the actual material and, in the case of uppers and lowers, where the forgings originated.

^ Subscribe to the FB Group:

 

 

https://www.facebook.com/heckinweaponmalfunctions/

 

 

It's got all sorts of fun.

I think you get a discount for the rifle after you take the course and you mail in the factory rebate to Windham.

 

 

That would be nice.

 

 

 

I wrote on the DDOG FB Page (in a thread which solicited ideas about what DD could do to better show off their ARs) that DD should team up with industry personalities again to run customer-appreciation/exclusive training classes in all the major regions. The post received I think the most "Likes" out of all other suggestions in the thread, but who knows. It wasn't an official DD solicitation, just one of those things where another member posted up a "what if" kind of deal.

 

 

 

 

I'm taking it at Great Meadows, gonna be a pain now that NJ law is 10 round magazine capacity so more than half the day will be spent reloading

 

 

Hey, at least you'll get in a lot of reps!

 

 

 

 

NJ law doesn't allow AR's shorter than 16" or AR pistols for that matter. Although under a weird loophope in our laws, if you start with a stripped lower and build it with a pistol brace and the OAL to 26" or more it's a "firearm" by the ATF's classification and from my understanding that's kosher. I just built one, I may use it for that class.

 

 

ARRRGH! I must be stupid.

 

 

 

For some reason, I can remember you're in NJ, just not that you poor folks have to abide by all those ridiculous laws.

^ It should be fun. Great Meadows or Garrettsville? I'm assuming the former?

 

 

 

Are you able to get a shorter gun for the class?

 

 

 

You'll give us all here an AAR, of-course?

 

 

 

Windham: not sure, Would look on their website to see.

 

 

 

I had a brain fart - that was both obvious and easy! :lol:

 

 

It looks like it just comes with one of his CDs, and that's it. But then again, that's par-for-course with these guns.

 

 

Buying a gun is not meant to be buying an experience like: https://www.cabelas.com/assets/cms/img/CLUB/theexperience/2018magpuldefensive.html

Many on reddit will argue a stripped lower is a stripped lower, I disagree because i’ve seen cheap lowers crack at the buffer threading from recoil. (See Anderson and Palmetto State)

 

 

Parts are never just parts.

 

 

In all honesty, you really owe it to yourself to listen to that 4-hour P&S ModCast on AR QC/QA, it's an amazing look beyond even hobbyist-level knowledge of the platform and the individual components that goes into the equation.

 

 

 

 

Spike’s makes good stuff, for someone on a “budget” that’s as cheap as I would go for starting with a stripped lower.

 

 

This I definitely agree with, too.

 

 

I think that for folks buying stripped lowers from "lesser tier" makes, the easiest thing for them to do would be to just take along a magazine (if not also a one-piece trigger assembly) - to get in good with the store personnel and go there on an off day, and let them allow you to at least drop in these easy components for a quick-and-dirty fitment test.

 

 

 

Certainly, it won't guaranty that everything will be peachy, but it'll at least rule out the most egregious.

 

 

 

 

I agree aero precision is inconsistent but having this discussion on reddit with 20 somethings falls on deaf ears.

 

 

Same with FB.

 

 

 

The knowledge that comes about from discussions always gets lost, and somehow the "TL:DNR" has become a legitimate response, instead of folks actually taking the time to read and understand.

 

 

 

It makes me both mad and sad.

 

 

 

But then again, people no longer read books (and I don't mean just hardcopy paper, I also mean electronically, or even via audio format)...I guess this really shouldn't surprise me.

 

 

 

 

Since my article got nixed on comparing rifles i’ll give you guys the details:

 

 

 

 

(Speaking of, TSI lmk if RCA ever does a factory sale)

 

 

I'll make a note of it, no problem!

 

 

Both Chris Cerino and Andrew Blubaugh are local to me, and they're aligned with RCA as partners, IIRC.

 

 

 

Windham Weaponry Way of The Gun( $1300-1600 street price)....

 

 

Do they discount Proctor's carbine course with purchase, or no?

 

 

 

 

Sig Sauer M400 Elite Ti ($900-1200 street price): If you’re on a budget and you want a tacticool rifle, go for it. If not, save your money. I wish Sig Sauer stuck to making products they do best. The Romeo Red Dot isn’t good, cheap cerakote job, trigger was too jerky there just wasn’t much to love. I do love the Rail but i’m positive it’s a Midwest Industries Rail. Accuracy wise it shot 3 MOA with Hornady Black and 1.5 MOA with the black hills. Doing the bumpfire test the bolt looked like a sledgehammer was taken to it. I had to sign an NDA with sig that I wouldn’t share photos of the damages since we didn’t publish the article. Sig made this rifle to have something in the low price point market, they put no effort in to it.

 

 

Uggh, that's sad to hear.

 

 

 

But thank you for your honesty.

 

 

 

 

Colt LE6920 ($600-900 street price)

 

 

Any idea of the date of manufacture on the Colt?

 

 

 

My good buddy has a 6920 that's been through a lot of class work and seif-driven practice and continues to be a solid gun, but a lot of folks I trust have poo-poo'ed recent-make Colts due to QC/QA issues. It's always been on my go-to list for recommendations for folks for whom the rifle will either be their first beater or is likely to be their only gun, but as of the last two years or so, I've only made the recommendation with the above caveat.

 

 

 

He's taken his time and upgraded it over the last two years as he's increased his shooting proficiency and started to really come into his own "style." He even took it to an armorer class where he as one of the students completely tore it down and rebuilt it.

I also notice that as I approach 40 years of age, the hair in my nose and my ears seem really really motivated to grow. Broke down and bough an eyebrow, nose hair and ear hair powered trimmer a few months ago.

 

 

I'm am not hairy at all but I had one hair that always grew out of the tip of my nose. My now ex- use to randomly try to pluck it as she went past me, the bitch.

 

 

I'm now 43 - I literally noticed this past year that my nose-hairs have not only seemingly become more numerous, but also significantly tougher (either that, or the scissors a lot duller all of a sudden! ).

 

 

I've also got a random blond hair growing out of my right deltoid.

 

 

 

 

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RE: triggers -

 

...the SSP might be a winner for those who like a single stage trigger that breaks like the proverbial glass rod (because all of us know what glass rods feel like to break....:roll eyes:..... cliche'd phrase...).

 

 

My occupation allowed me some rather interesting insight into this little tidbit, when I first started in on shooting as a real hobby. As a benchtop scientist, it's not uncommon for me to have to use a glass stir-rod. You can actually get them on eBay for pretty cheap.

 

 

 

Pro-tip: wear cut-resistant gloves when you're doing this, or just tape the pad of your finger.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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RE: THE RZA's article -

 

 

Man, that sucks!

 

 

 

Can you post the article, here, THE RZA? Or at least post your thoughts on the Sig?

True, that’s why i don’t buy cheap parts or buy cheap rifles. I saw this video a few years back and it still resonates, either spend the money on a factory rifle with all the features and build quality you want, or start with a good lower like a Spike’s or Aero Precision and buy quality parts the first time:

 

 

Be careful with Spikes and Aero.

 

 

While I've both seen good (Spikes) and have had good luck with (Aero) lowers, this is not something that's true across-the-board.

 

 

 

Discriminating communities like M4Carbine.net and P&S have both cited more than casual/anecdotal instances of lowers from these makes as being OOS, and also have reported other more major problems, too (Aero, specifically).

 

 

While I do not personally have enough experience with Spikes components to be able to say one way or the other, I do know from personal experience - albeit limited - that Aero's components can be inconsistent.

the kit I got was $110 and there was nothing "mil-spec" about it. ACT trigger, MOE Grip, Magpul oversized trigger guard, Noveske roll marked pivot and take down pins, Noveske/Magpul 60 degree ambi safety. All the creature comforts I've come to expect from a rifle

 

 

Understood - but I'm not talking about those "large" components.

 

Rather, I'm talking about the springs and detents - it never occurred to me (although it should have) that there's reasons for the specifications to which they are built to, too, and that sub-standard parts can cause rather disastrous functional issues.

have you tried other single stage triggers that light?

 

 

Not on an AR platform, unfortunately.

 

 

 

I don't know that it would matter that much to me, given how I shoot - i.e. the rather relaxed BSA template of "tactical/action" shooting, like what you're doing. There's folks who favor a good single-stage for target and hunting - and combine that with my interaction with some of the top-tier shooters, I really think now that the single versus two-stage issue on the AR platform is honestly a non-issue. There's more than a few tip-of-the-spear guys I know who shoot out to the 600 and beyond (with commensurately tight shots from the 100 and in) with single-stage triggers that I'm no longer convinced that a two-stage is necessary for absolute marksmanship (similarly, having seen some of the guys with fast trigger fingers run two-stage triggers, I'm also no longer convinced that a single-stage is absolutely necessary for burning things down, close-range).

 

 

I really think that in the above aspects, it's more about end-user preference than anything else.

 

 

 

In terms of safety, I am not really that worried: I'm a "finger out of the trigger guard, ya big doofus!" kind of guy.

 

 

 

My wanting to experiment with single-stage triggers in this context comes from the fact that -very- occasionally, I'll un-intentionally bump-fire a hammer with the SSA-E or MBT if I'm shooting from a compromised/unconventional position (like the brokeback, for-instance) when the stress of the drill/evolution makes it happen.

 

 

 

I was initially hyper-critical of myself for letting this happen, but one of my instructors re-framed it for me and caused me to re-examine it a bit: he asked me if what I did was in any way dangerous or was otherwise unacceptable. Given that in each instance I landed the shot into an acceptable BSA template (once on an A-zone mover at the 50 and the other on a mover of similar size and at similar distance, but in low-light), I was hard-pressed to say "no," but still, it was a round that I had not specifically intended to send downrange....and that's what's motivated me to look more at single-stage triggers.

 

 

 

thanks to /r/GunDeals I came across this deal (I HIGHLY recommend staying off the gun deals reddit if you like money, if you like guns but hate money, by all means)

 

 

Yeah, I agree! That and the mrgunsngear FB page are trying to ruin me!

 

 

 

 

It was worth spending the extra $50 on a deluxe LPK with the ACT trigger, Magpul MOE Grip and Noveske ambi 60 degree selector.

 

 

The 4-hour long P&S modcast on AR QC/QA really made me look at LPKs in a totally different light.

I haven't tried it, yet, and I really want to.

 

 

I can't really say anything about it until I've had finger time on it.

^ I debated between the usual for my daughter when she wanted to start shooting "real guns" a few years ago.

 

I figured that I could either let her grow out of a Cricket or Rascal, or have her grow into something, instead.

 

I ended up ordering a CZ452 Scout.

 

It's honestly one of the best decisions I've ever made. Instead of growing out of the gun, she grew into this one over the span of 3 or so years. We - myself included - still enjoy shooting it.

^ The reality is that Geissele has a 9-lb. brain, and his stuff is just so well designed.

^ Unable to edit last.

 

AAA-use is attractive to me because most of my earpro and admin lights are AAAs. I like the lithium primaries as they don't leak and gunk up in storage. It makes it one less item to carry in the range bag.

 

There's a slight weight savings to the lithium primaries, too.

I didn’t buy the Comp M5 just played with one at the store. Uses AAA batteries by the way.

 

Dangit, I knew I made a mistake! AAA! there, I actually typed out that last "A!"

Scalarworks’ factory and office is right down the street from my Range, it’s actually in the same complex as a gun shop i’ll stop by sometimes before I head to the range.

 

 

I've been very, very impressed with the return-to-zero on the Scalarworks for my MRO.

 

I've popped it off my gun and my daughter's gun several times, and all I do is dial back the adjustments I noted in my range book.

 

It's amazingly consistent, at least for within the 100.

Brief update. New rifle showed up on Friday the 27th of April. Free shipping from Brownells, which was 2nd day FedEx, so kudos to Brownells for stepping up on that.

 

I've been waiting for this update as eagerly as youv'e waited for the gun (OK, not realistic, but anyway ).

 

Shot only Winchester M855 that I have a good quantity of. My quest to find a barrel that shoots this garbage any better than 3.0-4.0 MOA will have to continue....

 

When you find that magic barrel, let me know where you got it from so I can get one, too, OK? I've finally gone through all of my M855 crap. I don't think I'm going with that stuff ever again since my most often practiced/class ranges here have limitations against steel-core, and I might as well just go with Mk262 Mod1 for everything else.

 

I don't see anything great in any of mine, either (DD LW, LMT, BCM BHF and standard [both ELW profile], and a nothing-special Aero/Ballistic Advantage). It's good enough for plinking and classes that are inside the 100, but at its best, it makes zeroing more work than it ought to be, and I'm ready to kill it just for that.

 

Part of this is due to the KAC bolt, unlike a normal AR bolt the bolt face is fully supported on the KAC, the normal extractor cutout in an AR bolt is gone on the KAC. Instead the KAC extractor is rebated to accommodate a fully supportive bolt face.

 

Remind me....the KAC SR-15s can also use a standard-configuration AR15 bolt/BCG, if-necessary, right?

 

What's the real-world life-span of the E3 bolt? I feel like I know this number, but I can't seem to place my finger on it.

 

...then decide what optic I really want on it. Currently mounting an NXS 1-4X24, laid hands on an Aimpoint Comp M5 yesterday and really liked it too.

 

A friend just got the new NX8, I really need to get eyes on it, as what I've read just makes me lust.

 

That M5's weight (especially with something fly like the Scalarworks mount)/size plus AA-use makes it really attractive, I've gotta say.

 

I'm jealous!

 

 

https://www.narescue.com/national-stop-the-bleed-day-bleeding-control-kit

 

 

There's only a few days left to get in on this excellent deal, directly from the makers of the Combat Application Tourniquet (C-A-T, aka "CAT").

 

This is a really, really good deal, as the CAT is typically a $30 item ($36, for the reinforced trainer) by itself, and also includes a $40+ QuickClot impregnated Z-fold gauze packet, too!

 

If you are active/reserve-LE and your department has not issued you something like this, you *NEED* it. If you are a hobbyist/sporting shooter, you *NEED* one of these kits. If you are an active outdoors-person, you really should have one of these kits. If you simply like to have a "First-Aid" kit in your vehicle, please understand that those kits are more for your everyday "boo-boos," and that to stop a traumatic bleed from, say, an amputation (a friend's MVA was the reason why I started carrying a kit like this) or penetrating wound from a vehicular accident, you'll need the items from this kit, too.

 

NAR also has an inert-chemical trainer for this Bleed Control Kit on-sale, for only a few dollars more.

I really want to shoot the P365. Saw one in person the other day and think that could be a new EDC. Size of my LC9s and holds 10+1.

 

Hit up MikeNH for his assessment.

 

 

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Take a 6 hour drive to Easton PA and come shooting while I still have the rifles!

 

I really wish I could! Bad timing!

 

We'll have to get together another time, though. Even without these rifles, I'm sure you'll have other samples to play with by then.

 

I didn’t know this rifle’s been out since 2012, based on that I’d say it was ahead of it’s time....

IIRC, it came onto the open market in first-quarter (if not January) of 2013. I am pretty sure that if you searched the M4Carbine.net Forums you'll see a lot of comparative "what to buy" posts about it stemming from that time, and similarly, I think the old BCM/Haley Strategic promo videos about the gun are still on YouTube.

 

I feel like now in 2018 when there are so many options out there for lightweight and thin rail systems, if I were BCM I would change to a MI or DD m-lok rail, or hell make their own because they make everything else at this point.

 

BCM put their own MLok ("MCMR") and 1913 ("QRF") handguards on the market as of earlier this year. They let the community know as of early 2017 (I think it was either at SHOT or shortly thereafter) that it would materialize by late '17:

 

http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?193899-BCM-KMR-M-LOK-late-2017

 

They're nice rails.

 

In the ultimate weight contest, their MCMR is still just a little heavier than their KMR-A, but that's the trade-off incurred in strength and repeatability.

 

But then again, we knew that with 1913, already.

 

And put a SSA-E trigger. With a $2000+ price point for this rifle, you gotta compete with a lot of other heavy hitters, it needs something better. I will be writing about this in my article.

Time travel makes everything better, but really, I think that the Jack is just a product of its times. Maybe you can spur BCM/Haley into updating this gun?

 

I think if you had to buy one and you had to choose, it would come down to personal taste in brand.

"Signature Rifles" were a thing at that point in time as well.

 

EAG (of the late Pat Rogers) had one with BCM, Chris Costa had one with Larue, Tricon (Jeff Gonzales) had one with LWRC, Vickers, with Daniel Defense. Tiger Mckee's "Katana" was a custom assembly that used off-the-shelf parts. Paul Howe had one with Wilson Combat, and Frank Proctor with Windham. I think Steve Fisher's collaboration with Midwest was the last of the breed that I really remember seeing, dating back to 2016. I'm probably missing a few, but those came to mind immediately, and most came from the 2010 to 2014 era.

 

I think that, really, today, these "signature guns" face a harder time because there's just so many good parts (and great rifles, such as the Knights) available at the higher price-points that it's really hard for a "signature" rifle to compete. Looking back at the Costa offerings through Larue (I think he had both an OBR and a PreadtAR), both sold-out, each time they were offered (I think they offered two or even possibly three runs, I believe about 100 of each for each run) they sold-out in a matter of hours, if not just minutes. I don't know that would be a reproducible phenomenon, today.

 

And that's not even counting the competition from what are otherwise really good complete rifles that had saturated the market at the $1200 to $1600 price-point, too.

 

Similarly, consumers have gotten a lot more knowledgeable in the meantime, too. The craziness/derp we saw under the Obama administration and pre-Hillary frenzies I think really taught a lot of folks a hard lesson about buying items that simply do not measure up. On the flip side, as more and more hobbyists are now engaged in seeking training and knowledge, we have another sector of the market who are exceptionally well educated about the gun and its components, and are ever more choosier about what they spend their money on.

^ Urrgh. The VB defect won't let me edit.

 

Speculation on why the gun handled, subjectively, "lighter" than I thought it would have.

 

It's possible that the 10-inch rail forced my support hand to be closer to the fulcrum, thus subjectively helping balance of the gun on the swing. I'm not sure that this is completely true, however, as my LMT MRP (DI variant) and my hobby gun both also have rather short rails/handguards, and yet both still handle like pigs.....

 

Could just be the fact that I subconsciously registered the Jack as a pricier gun, and therefore, that I'd better like it better?

 

I think I'd love to do a blind taste-test on it, if I ever got the chance to get my paws on one again.

^ Ah, my mistake. For some reason, I thought yours was a DI, too.

 

Are the control surfaces the same? I am not intimately familiar with the LWRC line.

 

He was gonna trade it in to a arms dealer and was confident he would get 1000, i told him no chance in hell, he would get stiffed. I’ll let him try to trade it in first, and when the dealer tells him he’ll give him $600 i’ll say 900.

 

Pretty much that, exactly. The gun-shops really do have to go low in order to make a good profit. I'm really surprised he thinks they'll give him anywhere close to his asking price.

 

...was a huge fan of the Jack. Only thing I can’t figure out is why they opted for the $500 giessele rail, but a $65 ALG ACT trigger http://emoji.tapatalk-cdn.com/emoji782.png For the same amount of $$ in parts they could have put a G2S or SSA-E and any M-lok rail & cerokoted it how they wanted. If I were them I would have done a Midwest Industries M-LOK rail and coated it.

 

I honestly thought that I wouldn't like the Jack as much as I did, when I got to play with one a few years ago.

 

I like lighter ARs, so the Jack's 7.1-lbs. spec'ed dry weight is a bit on the porky side for me, particularly given its 14.5-inch setup. Nevertheless, subjectively, the gun balanced really, really well (I tried to ignore as best I could the soul-crushing EOTech + magnifier setup the owner had on the gun ).

 

My best guess about the trigger/rail?

 

Remember, this gun dates back to 2012.....

 

At the time, that expensive Geissele rail may have been the only rail that really offered sufficient structural integrity to minimize/eliminate handguard deflection. It's possible that Haley's need to teach with NV/lasers made this concession a necessary one, particularly when we hark back to that period in history.

 

Similarly, Haley's professed love (even from his Magpul days) of the single-stage USGI/mil-spec trigger may well be why he chose to stick with the ACT trigger, regardless of the price-gap, especially seeing as the Geissele single-stage (the Super 3 Gun) carried nomenclature that suggested it was a gamer's trigger, which probably would impact a portion of the crowd for which this semi-bespoke gun's appeal was aimed towards.

 

Out of curiosity, does the current Jack still use the old-style BCM charging handle, or has it gone to the current generation?

^ Drive his price down to $900 ? That would be a really good deal, then.

 

Particularly if you were to flip it......

 

That said, an identical backup to your primary is always nice.

 

Politics and daily-life are necessarily intermixed, when talking about firearms, I think.