Gauging interest: Regular Guy lowering springs for 05-08 Legacy GT and Spec-Biz

Simple: As the options increase on the market for shocks for these cars, seemingly we need more spring options that perform better, give a level ride, dont take 8-10 weeks to come from Japan, and dont leave you sleeping in the garage when the wife gets the credit card bill.

After the success of our Yellows, Blacks, Wagons, and Evo springs and as we near the completion of our 08 and 09 STI and WRX springs, we did not want to leave out the Legacy audience. I spend more time in my Spec-B now than ever and alternate from the RCE Tarmac 1's to the Bilsteins with Pinks. I feel there should be a spring that barely if any lowers the car, maintains a level ride height WITH driver and full tank, and is matched to the 3 common options for shocks on the market, Tokico, Koni, and Bilstein HD.

Let me know your thoughts.

Myles Williams

RCE founder.

Sounds amazing. Something that doesnt break the bank too. If you sold it in combination with Spec B bilsteins too, that would be great.

It would be simple too. I would do an intro price for these for the first batch only to get it going. I like the HD's much more than the Spec-B Billies, but thats me.

Mw

Ive not driven either, just going by what Ive heard. I have been knocking around options for quite some time now. Waiting for a good deal to come around for me to take advantage of.

What is your logic behind preference for the HD's?

Myles,

As I've expressed before, I'm definitely looking for a new spring option.

I have been using Konis and Swifts on my '06 GT sedan, and while the ride is great on smooth pavement, and the stance looks great, the ride over broken pavement is simply too jarring for a daily driving commute.

I would be very interested in a spring that was the same rate as stock but with a slight drop. I know there is a balance between suspension travel and spring rate/length that must be observed, and consequently that may push me towards your coilovers, but perhaps you guys can find a compromise at a price point that works for us "regular guys".

I have already installed the whiteline roll-center correction kit and would be hesitant to go back to stock ride-height since I would have to swap in stock ball joints and tie rods. My understanding is that the RC-kit is intended for cars with a >1" drop.

One concern regarding your springs: would you guys make different front springs for the GT and Spec.B to address the difference in tophat thicknesses/spring perches?

Reference this thread for some of my measurements and pics of the Konis/Swifts combo.

By "Regular Guy" I mean a spring that is BLACK in color as NOT to draw alot of attention at the dealership. Lowers 10mm,..as in a REAL world 10mm, NOT the 10 that STI claims yet your wife notices the door handle is LOWER right off the bat and BLAM you are busted and cant be trusted !! rates that really are engineered for HD, Tokico or Spec B's, Koni's etc.

The amount of lowering really needs to be determined based on feedback. I would strongly suggest most to consider that the legacy is travel challenged to begin with, and that the best handling Legacy's arent lowered much at all, despite what tons of people will say and claim. So somewhere between what you guys want and what will work our objective is to make it. I just need to know if there is a market.

And yes we will have prototypes next week for our lowering and NON lowering RCE camber plates.

Myles

 

 

One concern regarding your springs: would you guys make different front springs for the GT and Spec.B to address the difference in tophat thicknesses/spring perches?

 

Reference this thread for some of my measurements and pics of the Konis/Swifts combo.

The issue I see is that the stock GT hats suck round objects with hair on them!! They flex and sometimes break. The spec-b hats dont flex nearly as much and yes raise the front of the car. So when I back into this, I see a need for a spring that works with Spec-B top hats and or say......our lowering or NON lowering plates. Since anyone stepping UP to something firmer SHOULD be using a firmer, less flexing top hat anyway !! Thats my thought on it this early in the process at least.

Myles

The issue I see is that the stock GT hats suck round objects with hair on them!! They flex and sometimes break. The spec-b hats dont flex nearly as much and yes raise the front of the car. So when I back into this, I see a need for a spring that works with Spec-B top hats and or say......our lowering or NON lowering plates. Since anyone stepping UP to something firmer SHOULD be using a firmer, less flexing top hat anyway !! Thats my thought on it this early in the process at least.

 

Myles

That may certainly be the case. However, AFAIK Konis are designed for use with the stock GT tophat. So... unless we can switch over to spec.b hats without ill effect, you would be alienating a great strut option.

That being said, the Swifts are designed for the spec.b tophats, and using them with GT tophats yields the stance I have now, which is perfectly even all around (as shown in the thread I linked earlier).

Hmnnnnnnnnn..............or buying the RCE plates !! lol. JK.

Ummm......well this is why we are talking about it too.

I will take that into advisement.

Myles

Hmnnnnnnnnn..............or buying the RCE plates !! lol. JK.

 

Ummm......well this is why we are talking about it too.

 

I will take that into advisement.

 

Myles

That's an option!

My concern about the plates would be increased NVH.

The more I think about it, the more I feel compelled to pick up some T1's next summer. It will be annoying riding on the current setup for the next 6-8 months, but with the wedding right around the corner, I could never justify spending even more money on my car this year.

Another consideration that may help you decide to settle on the Bilsteins is that they supposedly have a higher spring perch. If that is true, then the relatively inexpensive HD's may be the best option for those wanting to run a sporty, comfortable strut/spring combo, along with a reasonably tall and wide wheel/tire combo. That is something that RCE would have to investigate, in order to justify to their market.

Given your history and presence on the forums, I'm sure you're up to the challenge.

I'm going to express interest in a spring that lowers the car .8-1", offers a modest improvement in handling without much sacrifice in ride comfort, and works well with Bilsteins and other options. It would be a plus if it worked well with stock shocks for awhile too

Honestly, it seems like this is what the Cobb springs are except they go for a more aggressive drop (according to them).

Joe

That's an option!

 

My concern about the plates would be increased NVH.

 

The more I think about it, the more I feel compelled to pick up some T1's next summer. It will be annoying riding on the current setup for the next 6-8 months, but with the wedding right around the corner, I could never justify spending even more money on my car this year.

 

Another consideration that may help you decide to settle on the Bilsteins is that they supposedly have a higher spring perch. If that is true, then the relatively inexpensive HD's may be the best option for those wanting to run a sporty, comfortable strut/spring combo, along with a reasonably tall and wide wheel/tire combo. That is something that RCE would have to investigate, in order to justify to their market.

 

Given your history and presence on the forums, I'm sure you're up to the challenge.

Well in terms of travel, the T1's have more travel in the front than anyt of the OEM setups. The rear is simply limited by the multilink AND the huge bump stop with steel support. So .8-1.0 isnt a good functional idea at all. We have played with ride height on the T1's and when we run close to stock height the ride quality is amazing. Lowering a Legacy for looks works very well. Lowering a Legacy for function,....does NOT work well.

Mw

I have a 2005 GT Limited wagon. I'm looking for a Bilstein setup with springs that doesn't lower the car but gives me greater handling like the Japanese Bilstein suspension does. I was looking into Spec B wagon springs with a Spec B wagon Bilstein strut. Something similar would be nice. How does this compare to what you are thinking (minus the springs of course)

From the Short Review on Bilstein HDs and Swift Springs Combo thread

http://www.5-starperformance.com/servlet/the-987/Bilstein-Legacy-GT-Suspension/Detail

definitely interested for my future set of koni's. Still on the fence which spring to get

swifts

cobb

progress

rallitek and now these. Options are always good!

Also very interested in springs that give a mild drop but give a comfortable ride.

Basically, look at BMWs. Excellent handling, no wheel gap, comfortable. All daily driver suspensions should be modeled after their cars. And no, I do not own nor have I ever owned a BMW...just driven many and am always blown away at how the Germans have mastered the ride/performance equation.

I have HD/pinks and the performance and ride are good for me. you've driven my car (and shortly thereafter you put the HDs on your spec B!).

the ride is a little bouncy at low speeds. I have to be careful drinking coffee on Rt 1, but i'm cool with that because the car handles so much better than stock. as you already know, with the pinks the front gets dropped about 1/2 inch (with bilsteins) and the rear gets dropped over an inch. not great if you load the car down with weight.

I would like 1/2 drop front and rear with springs that are comparable in stiffness to the pinks. Or maybe something more progressive so low speed bumps aren't as harsh but will still provide control at speed. Anyway, if you need to test fit on a wagon let me know. I'm right down the street.

-erik

I'd be willing to drive down if you needed a day as well with an 08 sedan. I was just down in Oxford PA today, not far at all

Agree with what erik just wrote about the drop/ride quality.

Joe

Myles,

Sign me up. I was recently made aware of the Bilstein HD kit from 5-Star Performance in PA, however the missing link is the springs.

Well, I'm a Prodrive nut. I bought some new P1s for my GC6, and had a brand new oval-tip exhaust, and P1 driving lights ready to put on. But... I sold the car last week. I have a new '05 LGT Ltd. in my driveway. I'll need springs.

As I said to Andrew, if Prodrive had a spring for this car, I'd probably buy it. But I knew about your "Regular Guy" for the Impreza of course, since I've been around the block a few times on the other forums. It just so happens that, AH-HA! .... you're already planning it for the Legacy.

So. This is probably my ideal spring. A mild drop, say an inch at the most, and perfectly suited for we Regular Guys who want a little better handling, but don't want to bounce all over the place. I had an STi Ver.5/6 matched strut/spring set on the RS. A nice setup, and smooth compared to a tarmac or coilover arrangement. But still a bangy, crashy ride compared to what I really want.

I think you guys can do it. And I want in!!! If you need help, PM me. I can spread the word on RS25 if you like, and do my best everywhere else.

-Chris (RS25.com Super Mod, NASIOC Guru & LGT.com pseudo-n00b )

Agreed.

Mind you, the only recent car I can really compare to the stock LGT is my RS. It's stock suspension I thought was pretty decent, but definitely rolled a lot, in corners.

Personally, the LGT is much more stout, but of course does have its weaknesses. Just the typical OEM tradeoff. But I'm all about the 0.5 - 1.0" drop, just eliminating some of the ugly wheel gap to even it out. And still have nearly as comfy a ride, just not roll as much when you take a good turn.